08-06-2010 07:22 PM - last edited on 08-07-2010 12:02 AM by andyP
Many thanks for your treatise and the time you've taken to compile it. Also for the pdf which I shall print out (165 pp!). When I reported to my Australian source that their battery is not charging, they sent me a note describing how to handle a new battery (see a previous email). But he ended his message with: "If it still does not work well, please tell us your original battery model and computer model so that we can re-ship correct battery to you." Seems a very suggestive sentence. (a) Some of our batteries don't work "well" (b) You might have got one of those (c) They may not have sent the "correct" correct battery as per the data I gave them (d)The ID data I gave might not have been complete (doubtful) (e) &c. I have now emailed them to say that their specimen does not charge and I would be pleased if they could send me a tested replacement. [I'll quote these for the record here:
Laptop: LENOVO 3000N100 0768-4EM S/N xxxxxxx 06/05
Org.Battery: FRU P/N 92P1186 ASM P/N 92P1185 11S92P1185Z1ZB8W64C2DE]
Meanwhile I'll work on your directions to see if I get anywhere. There must be some significance in the fact that the behaviour of the replacement battery is identical to that of the original. The fitting of the new one, on the other hand, is not as tight as the original's. Looks the same but does not click in like the original. Perhaps that does not mean anything; but what does?
I've had this laptop now for some 3 years. Until 2 weeks ago it has always worked perfectly. And at no time, when it was still working perfectly could it be used on mains power without the battery being in place. That is incontrovertible. The most likely reason for its failure is that I had not used it at all for some 4/5 months. That was a serious mistake, whereof I was not aware until the last few days. So the battery drained to the last power drop. And it would seem that this complete drainage prevents the recharging. It could be that the reason why the replacement does not charge is because it has never yet been charged and that is what it has in common with the original. How come that Duck3's replacement charged quickly? It must have had some initial charge in it. For that matter, how come that Duck3 can work his laptop, ostensibly with identical ID,
without a battery in place - whereas mine needs the battery conduit?
Moderator Note; s/n edited for members own protection
08-06-2010 08:33 PM
And at no time, when it was still working perfectly could it be used on mains power without the battery being in place. That is incontrovertible.
Based on the service manual, then, your laptop has never operated normally.
08-06-2010 09:47 PM
It's my second laptop. The previous one I had made to spec from bare-bones in California, only for that beauty to be stolen from my house 6 months later. The Lenovo was allocated by my insurance company. An intriguing thought that it's probably never been "normal". I supposedly got it as new but I did have my suspicions right at the beginning that the laptop might have been near-new but used. On which page of the manual did you find that? That may be an opening to look into. The saga continues... I haven't finished with it yet. Don't use it at home anyway where we have two desk power beasts, also assembled to spec. NOT Lenovo, though I'm not averse to that company except for discontinuing a battery model whose laptops are still in full swing with batteries that have been suspect from the start.
08-06-2010 10:06 PM - edited 08-06-2010 10:06 PM
On which page of the manual did you find that? That may be an opening to look into.
p. 26, I mentioned it in a previous reply, where I quoted the manual (in italics) and then added my comments in regular print.
The main thing is that the vast majority of laptops will operate just fine with no battery installed, just plugged into the wall power.
08-07-2010 02:13 PM
Well, wonders do happen, it would seem. After 4 days of having the laptop connected to "wall" power, with the "StartupInterruptMenu" permanently on screen and with the (replacement) battery intermittently inserted and removed, the gremlins are at work to restore the system! When I pressed ESC this morning (abt 7.30am NZTime) two black operating screens appeared quickly in succession, followed by the full works of LENOVO RESCUE & RECOVERY. It is now 8.55am and the current process is: "Find the files that you want to copy either by searching or browsing through your hard drive. Rescued files will be saved to an external media such as a USB key". There are two columns, on the left "Select files from hard drive", and the right "Files to copy". A 320GB Transcend external HD is plugged in and it would seem that it's loading - 42205.00MB. At the very start of this process the screen told me that all files appearing on the internal HD would be saved thus, whereafter the laptop would be reverted to "factory state". I should imagine the operation will be going on for some hours before any more on-screen activity is noticed. Patience and persistence, coupled to intuitive probes without in any way interfering with the laptop's innards, appear to have stimulated a trigger that bounced the system into process. Needless to say I'm delighted; but we're not there yet. It does seem that the replacement supplied by my Australian source does work, contrary to what I was gradually coming to suspect but could not yet believe. I'll report more later....[now 09.10am].
08-07-2010 04:06 PM
Time 10.40am NZ. We have now come to some amazing results. In the course of the Lenovo Rescue & Recovery process it transpired that the laptop "died" on 8 February last at 2.52pm. I say 'the laptop' because clearly it was not just the battery that expired. I can't recall how long it might have been, prior to 8 February, that the laptop had not been used. Probably several months. Note the exact time of expiry! Well, now, the laptop has totally reverted to normal operation. The internet connection is active: all pending AVG, Microsoft and Adobe updates have been automatically installed. No file or app has been lost. Next I closed the laptop down, removed the battery and restarted on wallpower only. No problem at all! The machine functioned perfectly, without any hesitation whatever, without inserted battery! Of course, then I had to try the next thing: is the original battery really dead? No, not at all. I changed over the batteries: the old one worked perfectly. I then pulled out the AC plug:the laptop continued happily without wallpower. Go, fathom, as they say. Anyone any idea how all this hangs together? It would seem that a battery is not dead when it's totally discharged. It took 4 days - say 80-90 hours - for the replacement battery to get enough juice to trigger the boot. Would the old battery have done the same? I don't know; didn't try it. Putting the replacement battery on 'permanent' charge was a sort of desperation, I suppose. I now better email my Australian supplier (Mr.Chan Chi Wang, yep) telling him not to send me a replacement for the replacement. I bet he'll be happy too!
08-08-2010 10:02 AM
Your story beats everything I've heard about laptops. I have more questions that fit in a reply.
First I want to get one thing straight. Your original battery, that you thought was dead, has turned out to be useful, had never been fully discharged despite being unused for so long, and was able to start your machine without being recharged, once you got the machine going with your replacement battery. Is that true?
Also note that Li-ion laptop batteries such as yours actually have some complicated circuitry for safety inside. One common safety item is a cut-off switch. When this is activated, the battery will act dead, but may only need the cut-off switch to be re-set.
08-08-2010 01:15 PM
Yes, I tried for several weeks - off and on - to get the laptop started. The machine is mainly used when my wife and I go on longish trips i.e. longer than I have accommodation for pictures on my array of compact flash cards (15GB). The laptop is used both for decanting images from camera CF cards and to keep in touch with home. Next month we shall be going on our first long trip this year - to New Caledonia. So, working back, our last excursion was November/December to Cairns, North Australia. That means the laptop was not used for 9 months - much longer than I thought. My estimate till now was 4-5 months. Generally we go on longish trips twice a year, but we're getting on in years... The machine was disconnected from any power, stored in its bag with all its peripheralia. The (old) battery's charge then gradually leaked away until 2.52pm on 8 February when it ostensibly went "dead". I would not have known this if it had not been for the updating yesterday of the laptop's AVG antivirus software after the Lenovo Recovery app had its run.. At a certain point the AVG stopped when a message came on the screen saying that the laptop's date was wrong and needed to be corrected before the AVG update could complete. Yes, when the laptop was properly functioning with the replacement battery (obviously to my great amazement and elation), I decided on a few experiments - in a way, I suppose, to test whether what I saw was really happening. So first I removed the AC cable: as expected this did not affect the laptop's operation. Then I thought: I have been told that the laptop would function without battery with AC adapter connected. I removed the battery, and yes, the laptop continues to function normally and properly. Amazing. Hmm, I mused, what shall I do with the old battery; I hate throwing things away - the battery does look a bit like a bright jewel! So, instead of putting the replacement battery back , I inserted the old battery. Again, the laptop continued to hum happily - with the 'wallpower' still connected. I thought, well, if I now pull out the AC plug, without a doubt the whole setup is going to collapse and I'll be back to square one. However, on that move - I decided - would depend whether or not Im going to throw the old battery away without tears. It did seem a bit of a miracle to me that the laptop continued, without blinking, to function perfectly. Then, of course, I had to test the miracle. I shut down the laptop in the normal way. It did look forlorn and abandoned, so my imagination ran. I went over to my main desktop to write out and send my report to this forum. Then, about half an hour later, with a lot of trepidation and misgiving, I restarted the laptop - still loaded with the old battery. It booted normally, loaded WinXPpro normally, right to the full screen with its many pgm icons. I tried out the browser to see if everything was still loaded and accessible - yep, all +42GB of it. All ok. It is now 07.53am NZtime. The laptop has been shut down since last night, but with AC cable plugged in. I'm now going to restart it....rather confident of a positive outcome. And yes, there it is - connected to the Internet with its Asus LAN plug shining bright blue. AVG has loaded its daily update. I've put the replacement battery back into its superb travel pack and stowed it away for ...I don't know what for... yes, for use if ever there might be a repeat of this weird events sequence. Some very interesting lessons and tricks learned. I have emailed Mr.Chan to thank him, and to say "No, I shan't want a replacement for your replacement; all's well that ends well.Many thanks." I don't know about a cut-off switch, thresho, nor what and how a cut-on could have happened. But it did?