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davegoodmen
Posts: 8
Registered: ‎06-17-2010
Location: Toronto
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Purchasing Third party battery

Anyone try or recommend buying third party battery? I don't need it but its a option for the future.

 

Here is an example of a battery

http://cgi.ebay.ca/9-CELL-Battery-IBM-LENOVO-X200-X200s-X201-X201S-/200477548394?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Lap...

 

Sound too good to be true.

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Registered: ‎04-20-2010
Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

[ Edited ]
I would buy parts from Amazon.com. I do not trust people on eBay. Amazon is mostly shops getting rid of things at a cheaper price. --> http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1278703606/ref=sr_nr_i_0?ie=UTF8&keywords=lenovo%20x200%20battery&rh=i%3... But yes 3rd parties are not that bad. I have seen many posts of other users buying many different parts and saying the work just fine. I buy 3rd party parts for the PC's I fix for people, especially for laptop power cords.
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lead_org
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

generic battery quality can vary quite a lot, and can be different between each batch, due to poor quality control and materials used for the battery construction. 

Regards,

Jin Li

May this year, be the year of 'DO'!

I am a volunteer, and not a paid staff of Lenovo or Microsoft
topmahof
Posts: 3,137
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Registered: ‎01-21-2010
Location: Etters, PA

Re: Purchasing Third party battery

a lot of people on here will probably disagree with me but i buy everything on ebay.  you just have to pick the right seller.  the battery that you linked to.  the seller only has 243 feedbacks.  get your items from powersellers, the ones that have thousands of feedbacks and then go into the feedbacks and see what customers are saying about them.  i like ebay because the descriptions are usually very well detailed.  the descriptions on amazon are kinda sparce.  i've bought items on amazon that were clearly used. but the description doesn't say new or used.  so you have no recourse.  I have a service company and i have 2-x32s, 3-x41s, 1-x30, and 1-x40 that were all bought on ebay.  all the power adapters, wireless cards, batteries, ram chips, bluetooth chips, everything was bought on ebay and i haven't had any problems with anything. but, again, you have to do your homework.  don't just buy the first one you see, research the seller and the product.  i can buy 4 batteries on ebay for the price of one genuine.  if i get 1 year out of it all four will still last longer than 1 genuine.  and i've been getting 2 1/2 to 3 years use out of 1 battery.  and i don't do anything to prolong the life of batteries, i just use them.  ebay has come a long way from the old days, if a seller gets too many negative feedbacks, ebay will now yank their account.  or take away their selling discounts. so sellers now have to watch their Ps and Qs.  so it's a lot safer to buy something on ebay than it used to be.

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lead_org
Posts: 20,884
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

it is not so much of what the sellers sell, but rather the quality of the parts and the safety issues in relation to the battery. They may die or last shorter than a genuine battery, but that is not the biggest problem (you get what you paid for). But rather a lithium cell internal short circuit is quite a large accident, the generic battery doesn't have the internal control circuitry to detect a thermal runaway. 

 

HP have overheating batteries and they use cells from large manufacturers, what sort of quality do you expect from these cottage industry that manufacturer these generic batteries. It only takes a very small amount of contaminates within the anode/cathode or solid solution electrode, to cause a thermal runaway to occur. 

 

Obviously, this is a risk that the OP have to weigh in when buying generic battery. 

Regards,

Jin Li

May this year, be the year of 'DO'!

I am a volunteer, and not a paid staff of Lenovo or Microsoft
topmahof
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

you're right of course, except that there are still laptops catching on fire from genuine batteries as well as generic batteries.  if a battery shorts out, the smart chip shuts down the connection to the laptop, but the short in the battery is still there  and a heating episode still happens. yes, there are more safeties in a genuine battery  but until sony and samsung start making safer cells, the problem with batteries will still happen.  there are only a few mfgs that make battery cells and generic mfgs use the same cells as genuine mfgs.  i've taken apart quite a few batteries, genuine and generic and none of them use any kind of insulator to separate the cells inside the case.  instead, they depend on the sticky substance to hold the cells in place.  if somebody accidently drops the battery on its end, there's a good chance the cells will move together in the case and + to - happens and boom.  i really think that if mfgs insulate the cells a lot of the problems with batteries won't occur.  but until they do, it's a crap shoot with genuine and generic alike.  i tell all my techs that if they drop a battery to not use it at all.  bring it back to me and that's another one that i take apart to experiment with.

_______________________________________________________
T430u, x200T, 2-x61Ts, 2-x61s, 2-x60Ts, x32, x41T, x40, U160, ThinkPad Tablet 1838-22R, Z500 touch

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lead_org
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

[ Edited ]

Have you ever taken apart a Lenovo OEM battery before? i have, and the ends of the battery are insulated from each other with PCB boards. Let me find the battery that i took apart and post an image tomorrow. 

 

What you are saying about the positive and negative end touching each other is not going to happen. 

 

The run away reaction occurs within the cells itself, it got nothing to do with the battery end shortcircuiting. 

 

Moderator edit: Removed block quote of previous post to shorten thread.

Regards,

Jin Li

May this year, be the year of 'DO'!

I am a volunteer, and not a paid staff of Lenovo or Microsoft
topmahof
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

yes i have taken apart a lenovo battery before and the one that i took apart did not have insulators.  granted, that was a 2006 battery and maybe the newer ones were made different.  all i'm saying is that cells are still shorting out internally and even though the smart chip shuts down the charging system, the shorted cell is still in there and can still cause heat.  sony, in their infinite wisdom, decided to use a new system to crimp the cells and introduced impurities into the cells, hence the big recalls.  now, batteries only last a year or so when they used to last 3 and 4 years.  they don't degrade over time like they used to, now they just shut down.  and it's still happening.  there's more safeties and that's a good thing but the crappy cells are still being used.  because there is no one else making them.  japanese cells seem to have a better quality than other mfgrs, but it's still a crap shoot to buy a battery.  3rd party batteries have chintzier contacts in them and have a tendency to bend, the quality is not as good as oem so if you put in and take out the battery every day, sooner or later the contacts won't contact any more and the battery won't work.  what i don't understand is cordless hand tools battery cells are made by the same mfgrs and they don't have smart chips in them and i don't see them having the shorting problems like laptops.  and these tools are abused.  well i got off the subject enough,  i concede to you that buying an oem battery is safer, but who can afford half a netbook to buy a battery that lasts a year?  i know i can't so i guess i roll the dice and take my chances.

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lead_org
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

i am not quite sure what you are saying. If the safety switch is triggered, then the battery can't be used or charged, so i am not sure how they can still cause heat. 

 

Crimp the cells? what do you mean by that? 

Regards,

Jin Li

May this year, be the year of 'DO'!

I am a volunteer, and not a paid staff of Lenovo or Microsoft
topmahof
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Re: Purchasing Third party battery

http://blogs.pcworld.com/staffblog/archives/004233.html

 

i'm not sure how to post a link but this is just one article of sony's crimping technique that introduced impurities into batteries.  there's a small pic halfway down the page which shows.  sony changed the way they crimped the cells and it introduced small amounts of impurities into the cell which shorted the cells and caused heat and fires.  sony actually tried to cover it up but there was too many which triggered the mass recalls in 2006. 

 

a shorted battery causes heat all by itself without being connected to a charging system.  most of the laptop fires happened when they were just being carried in bags. they weren't being used, charged or anything. they were just being carried in a bag and they caught fire.  did you ever accidently go to tighten a battery terminal on your car and touch the wrench to ground?  nice spark, right?  if you left it there, the battery generates a lot of heat and it could explode.  an extreme example, i know, but laptop batteries can do the same thing because of the impurities in the cell causing shorting.  much smaller scale but the same effect.  heat.

 

i'm not saying anything new, this is all over the internet and it's old news.  but sony tried to say that only certain factories did the new crimping technique but i think that it was more widespread.  batteries should not fail in a year, lenovo has a very good safety in its' batteries so it's detecting something going on in those batteries.  and it's not all of them, just some of them. i just think that it's still a crap shoot to buy generic as well as oem. 

_______________________________________________________
T430u, x200T, 2-x61Ts, 2-x61s, 2-x60Ts, x32, x41T, x40, U160, ThinkPad Tablet 1838-22R, Z500 touch

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