11-22-2010 08:27 PM
If you're that certain that the laws are being violated, go to ACLU or find a competent attorney looking for an early retirement....and sue...maybe you'll make history.
Fact of the matter is - regardless of how any of us feels about it - that majority of users prefer Windows over all other OS options combined at this point in time and will not buy an unbundled system. Period.
11-23-2010 08:38 AM - edited 11-23-2010 08:46 AM
There are enough succesful cases, when people got their money in small claims courts. Though most simply don't have enought time to go through all the hassle.
While bundling itself is a primary problem, it normally should have a workaround. One of the legal loopholes for OEMs to escape the tying antitrust regulations is the availability of refund. I can even tolerate the bundling (since the majority uses Windows as you pointed and it gives them lower prices - good for them), as far as one can normally get a refund for Windows when one is NOT using it. Problems start, when OEMs (like Lenovo) suddenly deny the option of refund. This is completely unreasonable. Even if Microsoft gives them lower prices for their bundling, what is the reason not to give refunds to consumers who don't want Windows? May be it's a part of a deal with MS to make refunding close to impossible? If it is so - that's for sure illegal. Lenovo is one of the OEMs who explicitly state, that they don't provide Windows refund at all. Most other OEMs are simply ambigious about it, and when pushed - are giving refunds, though trying to avoid it as much as posisble creating all kind of obstacles.
11-23-2010 02:23 PM - edited 11-24-2010 07:20 AM
Most of the laptop company refund the customer couple hundred of dollars, which is more than what the customer pays for the os as part of the bundling.
This is nothing but a token gesture and not a refund at all. Also lot of those people whom got a refund don't remove the authenticity stickers, and they continue to the windows operating system.
11-24-2010 07:09 AM - edited 11-24-2010 07:12 AM
Whatever is the size of the refund - even if it's exactly how much OEM pays to MS - the user should be able to get it without much troubles. OEMs however aren't eager to disclose how much Windows licenses actually cost them, because their agreements with Microsoft are secret, and may differ from OEM to OEM.
Whether the user will follow the EULA and stop using Windows after the refund or not - it's user's activity. If they violate it - it's illegal, yes, but OEM can't act illegal themselves in the first place, to prevent potential illegal choice of the user.
12-04-2010 10:53 AM
A message that violated the forum rules was removed.
02-21-2012 09:47 AM
Recent ruling of the judge in France makes Lenovo pay license refund as well as legal damages for OS bundling:
06-27-2013 05:05 AM - edited 06-27-2013 05:52 AM
I want buy a Lenovo Carbon X1 in Russia, but I don't need preinstalled Windows. How can I get money back for not activated Windows 8?
And if it's not possible in Russia, please give me a contact of the representative in Russia which can give me confirmation of it.
If they will confirm it I'll report it to Consumer protection commitee.
03-17-2014 08:54 AM
It is not only that we do not like Windows to be on our laptop, it is FORBIDDEN by LAW in most states and countries.
By not having a proper policy in place, I believe Lenovo is not supporting it's customers in a proper way.
A lot of Linux users like Lenovo but do not want the operating system installed, or have some Linux flavour installed.
It would be great if Lenovo can improve the process of returning windows licenses, or even better, give customers a choice when selecting the product.
If Lenovo has such a small margin, I'd be happy to pay that margin anyway and not pay for the microsoft tax.
Looking forward for this to happen in the near future.