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About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-10, 20:13 PM

I have S340-15API with Atheros 802.11ac 1x1. This is a very lousy adapter for sensitivity and speed. If you are in 3-4m in direct line of sight to router, the speed is still acceptable, but if you take the laptop to 6-7m, not a major wall in house, then the speed drops to the infamous 40-60Mbit/s. At the same time, a nearby laptop with Intel 9560 2x2 surely shows 180Mbit/s+ in the same place. At the same time, it is impossible to watch a movie from the NAS via this troubled Atheros 1x1. in this place, the picture constantly freezes for 1080p movies (10-35Mbit/s bitrate).

 

Moreover, there are a lot of such stingers on this adapter in reviews of stores and on forums, i.e. this is not a bug of my copy of Atheros, but the architectural bug of all the this adapters in this series. Because people exchanged it on Intel 3165ac (9462ac) 1x1 and the speed and stability of the channel improved dramatically. But I don’t want to change it to Intel  1x1, because my router has supported 802.11ac 3x3 MU-MIMO for many years. And 9560 very good in anothe my notebook. I do not understand why Lenovo puts such squalor on laptops. which is impossible to use even behind the wall from the router. Therefore, I decided to change Atheros for 9560NGW, since there is every chance of supporting it.


I found in Parts for the S340-14IWL (81N7) series support for 9560NGW. I have 81NC, but it is not declared there. As far as I understand, should whitelists be the same for all series S340? Will 9560NGW be normally supported on a my laptop with a factory version of 802.11ac 1x1? Atheros connected by USB3.0 (in HWINfo) in M.2 2230 slot. Will two antenna wires in S340 fit the 9560NGW? And will the 9560NGW work for USB3.0, but not for pci-e or both mode available for S340 mainboard?

 

And I read that most stores sell 9560NGW without CNVIO support. Does it matter? I have already seen a branch here where the owner of the S340 tried to put 9260 (2x2 too), but with CNVIO support. He did not work. As far as I understand, since 9560 is already declared in S340-14IWL as compatible for the S340 series, it is obliged to work in S340-15API, the only question is what version should be bought in the store so that it does not make a mistake with BIOS support.

 

This version on photo from support.lenovo.com for S340-14IWL series (81N7xxxxxx):

 

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  • Message 2 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-10, 21:58 PM

Hi Dstone,

 

Greetings.

 

I would likewise doubt that 9560NGW would be detected by S340-15API.

 

Checking likewise with parts lookup, do not offer the same WLAN card for your model as it most likely are CRF modules that support Intel Integrated Connectivity offered in the S340-14IWL series.

 

Checking with a spare 9560NGW would confirm this if available.

 

 

Regards



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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-11, 0:09 AM

Checking likewise with parts lookup, do not offer the same WLAN card for your model as it most likely are CRF modules that support Intel Integrated Connectivity offered in the S340-14IWL series.

9560NGW sold in online stores, without CNVIO. At the same time, it is many of reviews from buyers which install this card without problems in notebooks with AMD chipsets, i.e. it version 9560NGW does not require any hardware support for chipsets from Intel. In addition, how do you explain then the compatibility of the Intel 3165AC with the S340-15API according to Lenovo (see screenshot below)? Doesn't 3165ac need CRF support too from Intel? Therefore, I was asked the question if I buy a 9560NGW that does not require CRF support in the motherboard chipset and without CNVIO, it is simply obligated to start on the S340-15API, but on one condition, if Lenovo did not set the stick into the wheels, by not making 9560NGW into "white list" in the BIOS, which other manufacturers do not allow themselves. I have 9560 in another laptop most likely with CRF, because there is a platform from Intel (Coffey Lake). Therefore, checking this option by it temporarily exchange in S340 is most likely pointless. Therefore, the key question is where can I see the “white list” of Intel 2x2 variants for Ryzen series or how to find out which ones will work. I do not want to install the same poor quality as Atheros 1x1, Realtek 2x2.

 

p.s. As you can see on screenshoot in the compatibility list of wlan adapters with the S340-15API series, Intel 9462 works fine in it as well. So, it doesn’t need support for Intel Integrated Connectivity? It turns out that nothing prevents the 9560NGW from working on the S340 with Ryzen, except for the direct ban from Lenovo, not putting it on the "white list" for BIOS in contrast to the S340-14IWL ...

pss - Lenovo made a laptop without RJ45 and at the same time install a disgusting wlan adapters from Atheros or Realtek, despite the fact that the fine Intel 9560NGW costs only $10 for retail prices...

 

 

I don’t understand why Lenovo didn’t put in whitelist for S340-15API Intel 8265NGW and 9260NGW? Judging by the keys and pins, they are fully compatible with the S340-15API, like the

 

 

Realtek 8822BE (01AX712 module) fully compotible with s340-15api series:

 check Realtek pins and keys with

...

 

See keys and pins for 9462 from s340-15api list:


 

 

And now see 9560NGW from online store:

Equal pins and keys with 9462NGW! 9560NGW obliged to work with s340-15api, unless Lenovo specifically, for marketing reasons, did not prohibit its use in a series with AMD ...

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  • Message 4 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-11, 13:25 PM

Hi Dstone,

 

Greetings.

 

Working with OEM parts would have BIOS whitelist as a challenge. Modifying it may work but is discourage as due to risk of bricking the motherboard. 

 

With changes or upgrades, OEM certified parts are recommended. Users would then take responsibility of such change they make specially if its outside warranty that may be worth the challenge but not guaranteed.

 

Regards



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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 7:51 AM

Working with OEM parts would have BIOS whitelist as a challenge. Modifying it may work but is discourage as due to risk of bricking the motherboard. 

How can I change the whitelist for S340-15API? It is very depressing and frustrating. Clearly a marketing constraint from Lenovo! 9560NGW is 100% compatible with the S340 series, as it is on the S340-15IWL list and its pins and keys exactly match the pins and keys for 9462NGW from the white list for S340-15API! Why is the 9560NGW not artificially whitelisted for S340-15API ?!

 

-------------------

I test my 9560NGW from another my notebook, it not work (not detected)... :-(

 

9260NGW and 9560NGW not work in S340-15API series, although a 9462NGW with exactly the same pin and keys layout works seamlessly by Lenovo's compatibility list for 81NCxxxxxx.

 

This means that Lenovo simply did not want to give the opportunity to install by users the network adapters from Intel 2x2 not whitelist them in the BIOS.

my 9560NGW:


 

9462NGW (01AX795) from whitelist for S340-15API (81NCxxxxx):

 

As you can see, there are no differences in pins and keys.

 

It remains only to patch the "white list" in the BIOS for the inclusion of 8265NGW, 9260NGW and 9560NGW. Or even remove this list...

 

Other laptop manufacturers have no such problems. Think what to buy

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 7:59 AM

The parts list does not equal a "whitelist". For example, my Yoga 530-14ARR apparently doesn't have a whitelist or blacklist at all because a not officially supported WiFi 6 AX200 works without flaw. The CNVi adapter just didn't work because it expects several parts of a typical chipset to be already included in the CPU SoC instead of the WiFi adapter alone. The AX200 is always a good bet, also the 8265 will work because that CNVi nonsense didn't exist at that time, and that card is supported in most laptops.

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 9:51 AM

Doesn't 9462NGW require CNVIO? Then why is it declared as compatible with S340-15API on Lenovo's website?

And how to know exactly which adapter without CNVIO (by photo labels and pins, keys) and work c S340 on Ryzen, and which one will not work with S340-15API?

Do you guarantee that if I order 8265NGW or (of course better) AX200 without CNVIO (how do I find out it before order), They will be work in S340-15API?

The bad thing is that technical support for months does not respond to anything. It has been several months since the requests to Lenovo, but there are still no answers...

 

I find in online store 9260NGW without CNVIO support by according seller notes for it, but he claims that he will not work with Lenovo and HP laptops, why if there is no support and need for CNVIO?:

 

At the same time, he claims the 8265NGW and AX200 are inoperative in HP/Lenovo laptops. Why, if you assure that they will work, since from your words they don’t need CNVIO support?

And why then does the 9462NGW work without problems in my S340-15API according to the compatibility list from the Lenovo support site? After all, he has exactly the same pin and key arrangement as the my 9560NGW from another my notebook and sellers also assure that the 9462NGW will not work with HP / Lenovo:
"Except for Lenovo and HP, all computers with M.2 2230 intel motherboard chip set can be used evenly.

 

The key question is how to determine on the network card whether it needs CNVi support (CNVIO) or not by label photos and pin/keys?

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  • Message 8 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 11:14 AM

For example, my Yoga 530-14ARR apparently doesn't have a whitelist or blacklist at all because a not officially supported WiFi 6 AX200 works without flaw.

And you didn’t think that the explanation of the AX200 on your yoga is simple and banal - due to the fact that this is one of the top series, the AX200, although it is not officially supported in the compatibility list on their website, was simply quietly added to the “white list” in the BIOS and therefore it is allowed to enter the hardware initialization stage? I do not believe that the 9560NGW from my other laptop is not functional on the S340 with Ryzen, since the 9462NGW with the same keys works without problems. The probability is maximum that the BIOS simply does not initialize it, blocking it due to the lack of a "white list", therefore it is not visible, although everything is in order with support from the motherboard. Otherwise, how can I explain that all the same works without problems in any laptop from Acer / MSI / Asus? And sellers guarantee that everything will work and AMD and Intel platforms. They just write about the fact that HP/Lenovo artificially blocks components to buy more expensive spare parts from themselves. And buyers need to know this before purchase.

 

Proof of the 9260NGW's performance on notebooks with Ryzen 3xxx series (from the T495s notebookcheck.net review):

Second proof of the 9260NGW's performance on notebooks with Ryzen 3xxx series (from the T495 notebookcheck.net review):

How did this become possible if the 9260NGW requires CNVio support from the motherboard and chipset, but this support is definitely not in AMD chipsets?

 

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 13:18 PM

Because the M2. 2230 WiFi adapters are fully-featured while the CNVi models are the M.2 1216 models that are soldered. Also, the Yoga 530 is a mid-end device and neither is the Yoga lineup in general high-end.

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  • Message 10 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-12, 21:47 PM

Why then the 9260 and 9560 (m.2 2230) do not work in the S340 with Ryzen and why do they work in the T495,495s with Ryzen?

Obviously, 9260 and 9560 are fully operational in S340-15API, the problem is not in them, but in the "whitelist" of BIOS, in which Lenovo did not include them for marketing reasons..

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-13, 7:28 AM

What do you even mean with "not working"? Did you try them or what? 

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  • Message 12 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-13, 21:03 PM

You then carefully read a topic? I already wrote earlier that 9560 from another of my laptop was not detected in my S340.

 

Based on the available data on the 100% working of 9260 in T495 and T495s and on the basis of the feedback from another S340-15API buyer on the same forum that 9260 was not detected in his S340, I come to the logical conclusion that the problem is exclusively in the whitelist from Lenovo. So, in the direct opposition Lenovo's marketers, for buyers of the cheap S340 series with Ryzens, so that they could not even try install high-quality components from Intel into a cheap series with AMD hardware. Everything is clear and clear. And it's disgusting...

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-14, 8:25 AM

Considering thee system will fail to boot entirely with the whitelisting in action, I really doubt that it is that. My device is mid-end at best and it still works, so the chances that you got a CNVi card or a defective one are not that low. You should have gone with a 9260 that isn't a CNVi module. I would recommend reading Intels link to that

https://www.intel.de/content/www/de/de/support/articles/000026155/network-and-i-o/wireless-networking.html

Especially the part that reads "These CRFs can only be used in certain Intel CPU/Chipset systems that are designed for it". Guess what, the 9560 is listed. Just because it works everywhere else doesn't mean it works in your laptop. And I am certain that it has nothing to do with a whitelist, because the system would fail entirely after it detected an unsupported card. Just not working is typical for a CNVi module.

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  • Message 14 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-14, 19:21 PM

so the chances that you got a CNVi card or a defective one are not that low.

9560NGW perfectly work in my another laptop and was installed there at the factory.

 

These Intel® Wireless Adapters are Kev modules that support Intel® Integrated Connectivity:

     Intel® Wi-Fi 6 AX201
     Intel® Wireless AC 9560
     Intel® Wireless-AC 9462
     Intel® Wireless-AC 9461

These CRFs may only be used with certain Intel processors / chipset on systems / motherboards designed specifically for this purpose.

 

Intel 9462NGW declared Lenovo as compatible with S340-15API (81NCxxxxxx).

 

In fact, Intel is lying by writing such a text, at your link. I would have understood if the following had been written there - fully autonomous modules can work both in CNVi mode and without it, but at the end of this text from Intel the possibility of working 9462 on a non-Intel platform is denied! And this is immediately refuted by the availability of workable modules with the same name in S340 (9462NGW) and T495 (s) (9260NGW).

 

How do they work there, if they are only in the CNVi variant? Therefore, the cited text is nonsense or pulled out of some context.

And the presence of 9260 and 9560 modules on aliexpress without CNVI support refutes this Intel claim and your false reference.

 

You are constantly writing what are the wrong assumptions that should already be excluded by you based on already existing data from me in this discussion.

------------------------

In addition to the whitelist, there are no more variants to left. Lenovo representatives do not enter into the discussion, which is also characteristic. And users continue to suffer with defective architectural network cards from Atheros and Realtek (2x2), despite the fact that the better decisions from Intel - 9260NGW, 9560NGW and AX200 are 100% compatible with AMD motherboards, which proves by worked 9462NGW in the S340-15API list of compability and that proves by 9260NGW used in T495 and T495s, which exclude any presence of CNVi parts on AMD hardware and your link does not prove anything other than obvious delusions from Intel.

This is the second time I’m asking a key question - how to distinguish "A Companion RF (KEV) module in M. 2 form factor (2230 and 1216 soldered)" that works only with CNVi part of Intel chipsets and a completely autonomous solution that works on any chipsets and Intel and AMD, what follows from the presence of 9462NGW in the compatibility list S340-15API?

 

Where can I see the differences between 9462NGW in the CNVI version and without it, as on photo from Lenovo support site, a fully-fledged solution?

 

And also similarly - аccording to the data on the label, I can determine that my 9560NGW in my other laptop is installed as "A Companion RF (KEV) module in M. 2 form factor (2230 and 1216 soldered)", and not a full-fledged module and did not work in my S340, simply because it’s not whitelisted by Lenovo for this series with AMD?

This question can only be solved by an official representative of Lenovo, but persons is not even trying to participate here...
 
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  • Message 15 of 21

Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-15, 22:23 PM
Someone from Lenovo's official support will finally answer which version of the 9650NGW or AX200 I need to look for in stores and buy? I do not want to put Realtek 2x2 from the compatibility list, because It is buggy and there is no manual control of the transmitter power.

I am absolutely sure, based on the data already studied, that the 9650NGW and AX200 are fully operational on AMD motherboards, the question is whether to choose the correct version of these adapters or confirm that they are not in the whitelist in the BIOS. If the second, why does technical support not give me a clear answer? And why is there no normal BIOS with a whitelisted 9260,9560 and AX200 for S340 with Ryzens?
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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 7:01 AM

To assume that you are correct is pretty arrogant, if you ask me. The support will not answer to such requests, and it is pretty naive to expect answers to such know-it-all questions. Take the AX200 or 9260 because there are no CNVi versions of these. CNVi are the 9461, 9462, 9560 and AX201. But I'm with you about the bad Realtek WiFi adapters, these are basically good for nothing and cause more trouble than one might expect.

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 11:39 AM

Take the AX200 or 9260 because there are no CNVi versions of these. CNVi are the 9461, 9462, 9560 and AX201.

Firstly, 9462NGW is declared as compatible with S340-15API (81NCxxxxxx), which means that it exists 100% either in the full version without CNVi or just that the usual hybrid version (work everywhere) is simply in the whitelist of BIOS for S340-15API(81NCxxxxxx). I have already written about this several times, with direct evidence from support.lenovo.com. Are you able to understand what I wrote earlier?

Second - nother buyer on this forum already clearly wrote that the 9260NGW did not work in the S340-15API, which proves that there are either two versions of the 9260 with CNVi and a fully autonomous, rather than CRF module that requires a CNVI part on the motherboard chipset, or it also as I have in S340-15API, the adapter wasn’t identified for the trivial reason - it is outside the BIOS whitelist.

And to get a clear answer, I need a consultation from Lenovo's official tech support, but she is silent like a fish already what day, although representatives are on the forum, i.e. they carefully circumvent this topic as exactly the same in the section on the S series.

Not only that, I was asked a number of technical questions on other obvious problems of the S340 series, including obvious inconsistencies in the user manual (and declared technical specifications, including marketing ones), but no answer was received either.

Also, despite the direct technical support questions sent to their mail 1.5 months ago, I still haven’t received a single sane technical answer, although my questions hang on my serial number in escalation mode.

Is this a normal situation for good business on a global scale?

This silence suggests some unpleasant conclusions for Lenovo as a company. Those who want transparency, a good reputation, decency in doing business with customers will not pretend that they do not notice the questions of the buyers of their products, they will answer them clearly and technically.
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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 12:58 PM

It is listed as "equivalent", not "compatible". These are two different things. That card is listed because it might work. You can always look up the FRU# and buy that instead, although that will be fairly pricy. For exactly that reason I bought the AX200 instead of the 9462, because that was also on my buyers list. What I would also recommend to you is the 8265, because that is known-good and reliable.

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 13:16 PM

It is listed as "equivalent", not "compatible".

It is clearly and clearly written as an official substitution as defined by “substitute” on Lenovo's website. substitute equal compatible is 100%. At least in the version wlan adapters indicated on the lenovo's site, for which there are 5 photos with all numbers and articles, including the article of Lenovo, not Intel.

What I would also recommend to you is the 8265, because that is known-good and reliable.

I will buy nothing and waste my money until I get an official answer from Lenovo, which models and in which version wlan adapters from Intel  will work in my laptop and, in general, in the 81NCxxxxxx series. Because the goal of my publication is to pay attention to inadequate technical support from Lenovo and ensure not only yourself, but also all other customers a painless, financially and loss of personal time, replacement of the wlan adater with normal 2x2 from Intel for versions with Ryzen. Because the price of these decisions is cheap. And as the situation with the T495 (s) showed, Lenovo had no technical problem and problem in terms of the cost of putting even the AX200 there at once, not even the 9260NGW as in the T series. AX200 costs $15 in stores, QCA9377 retail price is $7-10.

 

p.s.

I am very saddened by this attitude of Lenovo towards its customers, and I am its long-time client, the owner of the Thinkpad T series and the owner of their monitor.
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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 14:24 PM

You do realise that you will never get an answer from Lenovo since you are not having a ThinkPad device? ThinkPads are known to be officially upgradeable. The WiFi adapter is not even listed as CRU so it is not upgradeable as per Lenovos terms. What makes you think that this has anything to do with bad customer support? It isn't. You wouldn't get responses from any manufacturer regarding unofficial upgrades.

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Re: About WLAN supported adapters for S340-15API series

2019-10-16, 18:24 PM

Other manufacturers do not limit the client in any way. All of these adapters will work perfectly in Asus and Acer, and in MSI and Dell, and only Lenovo and HP create artificial obstacles in the way of upgrading their devices. Purely marketing, because technically there are no restrictions there and cannot be. And this topic is widely discussed on the Internet.

 

You do realise that you will never get an answer from Lenovo since you are not having a ThinkPad device?

I own a Thinkpad.

 

So I did not get a clear answer. What is the reason for the inoperability of my 9560NGW from another notebook in S340?
Apparently, there are no technical independent specialists here, and technical support is not responding, because there is basically nothing to say to, because apparently the company’s policy does not allow them say about block  adapters through the whitelist. But I turned to the forum, in the hope that there are other people here who can clearly explain what is the reason. I actually need this to make the right decision how to proceed.

I bought this laptop not for myself, but as a gift for my relatives and found that it was impossible to use it already behind one non-capital wall at a distance of 6-7m, even with my 802.11AC 3x3 router. The signal is so bad that the speed drops several times and becomes below the permissible level in accordance with their channel on the Internet. At the same time, other my laptops with Intel 802.11ac 2x2 in this place show excellent results. Therefore, I need to replace this garbage QCA9377, with a normal 2x2 from Intel, since I still have to spend money. I won’t buy again the wretched 1x1 from Intel, why do I need this? And such a problem exists only with laptops from Lenovo and HP, only they quietly forbid customers to freely change components by creating vile white lists in BIOS. No other manufacturer introduces such restrictions. And in this case there is no technical reason why the 9260, 9560 and AX200 would not be able to work in the S340-15API. I found out it by investigating and comparing the facts of their performance in T495(s) and the direct performance of 9462NGW in 81NCxxxxx, according to Lenovo website information.

Operation at 2.4 GHz is simply impossible, there are too many neighbors and the disgusting noise immunity of 2.4 GHz in the S340. Because of this, even mice with a 2.4GHz receiver refuse to work when inserting any USB 3.0 flash drives ...

I turned to the forum because the technical support pretended that the problem does not exist even on those issues that related to real technical problems with the laptop (no answer for 1.5 months). Taking advantage of the fact that the head office is located outside the my country and I can not exert any legal pressure on it, only on the seller. This situation is typical for all countries, especially in third world countries, except the United States, where manufacturers of equipment behave completely differently, afraid to lose the main market of the planet...

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