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05-30-2021

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YOGA 9i 15" USB-C / Thunderbolt Ports Support Power Delivery But Cannot Charge the Machine???

2021-05-30, 5:29 AM

Hi there, 

 

I currently own a YOGA 9i 15" (15IMH5 Type 82DE) for about a week and noticed that the machine gives zero reaction when a functional PD charger (100W) is connected to either of the USB-C ports. On the spec sheet it says that the two USB-C ports support "Thunderbolt 3 (support data transfer, Power Delivery and DisplayPort™ 1.4". 

 

I previously own a 5th gen ThinkPad X1 Carbon and an IdeaPad Slim 7 GTX 15" , and both of them can charge off USB-C with no problem. It is also worth mentioning that both the IdeaPad and the YOGA has a GTX 1650/1650 Ti Max-Q graphics card and comes with a 135W AC adapter, so it is not because that "the machine is equipped with a more powerful charger." 

 

"So the ports might be defective!" I think, and contacted customer support for help. To my very surprise, the customer support claims that the "PD" charging capability is only for charge another laptop? Why? Who will ever need to charge a laptop with another laptop??? And how can a $3000 (Canadian) machine not supporting this basic function of thin-and-lights that can be found on lower-end laptops, even years ago? If this is true, and it is clearly stated on the product page (not vaguely "supports PD charging etc."), I would go for another model instead of this. Why this is a deal-breaker for me? My 100W PD charger is only about half of the size of the original adapter, and much lighter. I feel like at this price point there really should be no compromise what-so-ever. 

 

Could someone confirm the situation? I wish I was wrong and missed a setting somewhere. Thank you for your time and take care out there.

 

Fine regards,

 

Simon

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4445 Posts

12-22-2008

Canada

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Re:YOGA 9i 15" USB-C / Thunderbolt Ports Support Power Delivery But Cannot Charge the Machine???

2021-05-30, 12:11 PM

Welcome to the forum.

 

Don't shoot the messenger but the USB-C PD standard limits the feature to 100W. Since the Yoga 9 comes with a 135W charger it requires more power than PD can deliver. There are no USB-C USB PD chargers that deliver more than 100W. This is a limitation of the standard, not a fault of the Yoga 9. (I agree that the product specifications should make this clear.)

 

As for your previous X1C5 and Slim 7 models, they were able to charge using USB-C because they required less than 100W.


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3 Posts

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Re:YOGA 9i 15" USB-C / Thunderbolt Ports Support Power Delivery But Cannot Charge the Machine???

2021-05-30, 15:54 PM

Thank you for replaying Haussman,

 

I understand that PD protocol only delivers up to 100W of power. Nevertheless, the machine will not run at 135W of power at all time; for example, it refuses to utilize the dedicated GTX 1650 Ti even when the integrated Intel graphics is at 100% utilization under normal work load, showing the system power management is truly aggressive on power saving.  

Also, my IdeaPad Slim 7 GTX has a 135W AC adapter but still supports PD charging. It has a dedicated GTX 1650. 

If the PD standard is only for charging other devices, what is the point? I have never heard people charging a laptop with another laptop. So basically this “PD Out” capability is useless?

(While I am writing this post, I tried to charge my IdeaPad with both ports, and nothing happened. So even this “PD out” is not working now??) 

I am quite frustrated because even my IdeaPad supports PD charging and the product page of the YOGA did not clarify this limitation. At this price point things like this should not be compromised, and I can see how someone who does not have other similar devices to compare will just assume that this limitation is present for all other laptops with dedicated graphics. 

Thank you and have a good one,

 

Simon

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4445 Posts

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Re:YOGA 9i 15" USB-C / Thunderbolt Ports Support Power Delivery But Cannot Charge the Machine???

2021-05-30, 20:23 PM

I appreciate your frustration and I agree that Lenovo should make clearer the limitations of USB-C on systems that draw more than 100W.

 

Something to consider. Notebooks run on 20VDC. At 100W that represents a current draw of 5A. According to AWG Wire Gauges Current Ratings the USB-C connector needs to have wires of 20 gauge or heavier, at least for + and - 20VDC. That's a fairly thick wire gauge for such a tiny connector with so many contacts. So the standard actually uses 4 pins/wires for each of + and -. That's 8 pins out of the 24 in the connector and in cables.

 

I suspect the original USB-C designers probably never contemplated using this standard to power devices that need more than 100W. We'll likely have to wait for the next generation of USB connectors to see USB power delivery that's capable of more than 100W.


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Re:YOGA 9i 15" USB-C / Thunderbolt Ports Support Power Delivery But Cannot Charge the Machine???

2021-05-30, 20:45 PM

Yes I understand the P=IV relation, and understand that it is a considerable amount of power going through that one port.

 

However, both my PD charger and the cable supports 100W power transfer, which is proven to be working flawlessly on my IdeaPad (100W even supports Rapid Charge in Lenovo Vantage!). Thus the current generation PD protocol can support 100W charging. 

 

For the YOGA, it will not even detect anything when a charger is plugged in; on the other hand, my X1 Carbon comes with a 65W charger, and when connected to the IdeaPad, it at least shows "connected but not charging" or some times "Slow Charger connected". 

 

(Specs for the IdeaPad Slim 7 GTX: Intel i5 10300H; GTX 1650 non Max-Q. 

Specs for the YOGA 9i 15: Intel i7 10750H; GTX 1650 Ti Max-Q.)

 

My point is, why a high-end model from Lenovo cannot support a feature that a slightly lower-end device with the same generation CPU (Intel 10th) and GPU has. I have already reached out to the customer support since the port can neither charge or discharge. 

 

Thank you again for answering my concerns and I will try to follow up on the outcome of the repair. 

 

Simon

 

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