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Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-23, 21:40 PM

Here's my result of installing the 24.21.14.1195 NVIDIA driver.

 

1. Reverted the BIOS to be Hybrid

2. Downloaded the NIVIDIA 24.21.14.1195 drivers

3. Forced a clean install

4. Installed the Thinkpad Intel Video drivers ( 24.20.100.6344 )

 

 

 

Note that I still have the NVIDIA Virtual Audio Device installed. When I connected the Samsung TV through the HDMI, the NVIDIA HD Audio suddenly appeared. When the TV is disconnected, the HD Audio is no longer enabled, but is still in the system.

 

 

 

 


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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2458 Posts

06-13-2013

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Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-23, 23:31 PM

Seems we're beginning to agree there's something not normal here... and it seems related to the latest driver packages, which include this new 1.3.37.x NVidia HD Audio version (1.3.37.4 in the Lenovo-supplied installers, and 1.3.37.5 from the NVidia-supplied installers).  My own story has ZERO PROBLEMS over the past 5 years (for my W530 and Win7/Win10) and over the past 2 years (for my P70 and Win7/Win10) using (a) all Lenovo-provided Optimus installers prior to the current 398.36/1.3.37.4 and (b) all NVidia-provided NVidia Quadro (Notebook) installers prior to the first 411.61/1.3.37.5.  It's only now with these latest driver packages all of which include some version of 1.3.37.x Nvidia HD Audio driver that problems have now started, and this includes all newer WHQL (411.xx) and beta (416.xx) driver versions from NVidia.

 

And it also now seems experimentally proven related to operating in either (a) hybrid graphics mode (which never was crucial in the past) but which now seems crucial to having this newer HD audio driver both install properly and then "work", or (b) discrete graphics mode which seems to trigger the installation installation difficulties never encountered before and requires newly invented workarounds and techniques.  Most importantly it seems to "fail" in some way with discrete graphics active, and "work" with hybrid graphics active".  And by "fail" I mean anomalous results like disappearing NVidia HD Audio in Device Manager and Playback Devices even when an HDMI cable is connected, and therefore the inability to deliver audio via HDMI, thus forcing Realtek laptop speakers only.

 

My experience is that if I install ANY OF THESE LATEST 1.3.37.x-related DRIVER VERSION PACKAGES (either from Lenovo or Nvidia) while in hybrid graphics and then remain operating in hybrid graphics mode, that there are no audio or video anomalies. No installation issues, using the exact same standard installation approach I've used for years and no post-installation disappearing HD audio in Device Manager or Playback Devices no matter whether HDMI cable is connected or not (again, "show hidden/disconnected devices" is checked).

 

Not true with discrete graphics.  Same normal "custom" Nvidia or "automatic" Lenovo installation seems to go fine and appears 100% normal when it completes. Except that after re-booting and trying to operate, for me NVidia HD Audio device is no longer in Device Manager and Playback Devices even when an HDMI cable is connected.  Only Realtek is available, along with the newly present NVidia Virtual Audio Device (WAVE Extensible) (WDM) in Device Manager which doesn't seem to have any counterpart in Playback Devices.

 

I mention that this new NVidia Virtual Audio Device never appeared for me while installing with discrete graphics active.  Perhaps it might have appeared if I'd run the installation TWICE as was mentioned as a workaround that magically made this new device now appear.  I never thought to try that, and never actually knew about it until I experimented with being in hybrid graphics during installation.  For that situation the new NVidia Virtual Audio Device appeared immediatly after the FIRST install... with hybrid graphics in effect.  And once installed it remains, no matter HDMI cable connected or not, no matter NVidia HD Audio present or not.

 

So for me it's either TWO devices (Realtek and Virtual Audio) or THREE devices (Realtek and Virtual Audio and HD Audio), but I only see three if I'm operating in hybrid graphics, but the three are always present (and disconnected "ghosts" appear in Playback Devices) no matter whether HDMI cable is connected or not.  With discrete graphics I only see two, never three.  And there is NEVER an Nvidia HD Audio device present either in Device Manager or Playback Devices, even when an HDMI cable is connected.  It may be necessary to re-boot several times to let Windows sort all of this device confusion out, in order to finally arrive at a consistent configuration's situation to evaluate as either "working" or "failing".

 

It's clear there's a problem here, undoubtedly and absolutely related to how first installing and then subsequently trying to operate with the newest 1.3.37.x Nvidia HD Audio Driver has impacted the Lenovo laptops running in either hybrid graphics or discrete graphics both for installation and then for operation.  There never previously was any problem using and driver package with 1.3.36.6 over the past years that was caused by operating 100% in discrete graphics while installing or then when operating.  But there now exists problems with all newer Lenovo-provided and NVidia-provided driver packages containing 1.3.37.x which now seems to require hybrid graphics for 100% problem-free installation and operation.

 

Want to install or run with discrete graphics?  No more HDMI audio... at least that's my experience.

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2217 Posts

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  • Message 33 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-24, 3:36 AM

I believe that this is a hardware issue with the HDMI and the thunderbolt drivers/firmware. Smacks of what we experienced 2 years ago when the hdmi would not work at all. Just wiped all of the drivers and I am reinstalling all of the code. I still cannot get sound on the HDMI connected TV when discrete graphics is used. NP if in hybrid mode. :(


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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2458 Posts

06-13-2013

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  • Message 34 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-24, 9:31 AM

Although this other thread which started in early December regarding Thinkpad P1 and X1 Extreme getting "bricked" when changing BIOS from the factory default of hybrid graphics to discrete graphics involves a different machine than the P70 and my W530 and Win10 and HD Audio drivers, and appears to be strictly involving a BIOS situation rather than something involving Windows and drivers, it is interesting that there's another contemporary story involving hybrid graphics vs. discrete graphics.

 

Also interesting in that other thread is a post from just the other day by Andy_Lenovo saying that Lenovo Engineering has determined the problem to be BIOS-caused, and that they are releasing a corrected BIOS 1.17 (for the P1 and X1 Extreme) today 12/24 which supposedly cures the problem.  In the meantime since there is no user-available solution to the "brick" other than warranty service by Lenovo, he cautions other users to ABSOLUTELY DO NOT switch BIOS from hybrid to discrete unless the BIOS is updated to 1.17 first.

 

I realize this other issue seems totally unrelated to our HD Audio story in this thread, but the tie-in with hybrid graphics vs. discrete graphics being relevant is an interesting coincidence.

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2217 Posts

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Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-24, 12:47 PM

There is something in common with the discrete graphics issues on the various workstations, but the issues seem to manifest themselves differently in the instances. I cannot check my P1 in discrete mode UNTIL BIOS 1.17 is released so I cannot try to correlate my findings on the P70. One of my tests excercised the P70 Thunderbolt software/firmware to see if enabling those from Vantage changed the audio output. The answer was that the Samsung TV showed connected to the P70 for video, but the Audio connection showed that it WASN'T present! Cable connections did not change from when I had the system running in hybrid mode.

 

  • NVIDIA Optimus Display Driver for Windows 10 (64-bit) - ThinkPad P50s, P70, T460s, T560
  • 24.21.13.9836
  • 29 Nov 2018

NVIDIA High Definition Audio

NVIDIA Corporation

6/26/2018

1.3.37.5

 

 

 


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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2217 Posts

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  • Message 36 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-25, 13:56 PM

 


 wrote:

There is something in common with the discrete graphics issues on the various workstations, but the issues seem to manifest themselves differently in the instances. I cannot check my P1 in discrete mode UNTIL BIOS 1.17 is released so I cannot try to correlate my findings on the P70. One of my tests excercised the P70 Thunderbolt software/firmware to see if enabling those from Vantage changed the audio output. The answer was that the Samsung TV showed connected to the P70 for video, but the Audio connection showed that it WASN'T present! Cable connections did not change from when I had the system running in hybrid mode.

 

  • NVIDIA Optimus Display Driver for Windows 10 (64-bit) - ThinkPad P50s, P70, T460s, T560
  • 24.21.13.9836
  • 29 Nov 2018

NVIDIA High Definition Audio

NVIDIA Corporation

6/26/2018

1.3.37.5

 

 

 


I was finally able to install BIOS 1.17 on my P1 so that I could enable discrete graphics and test the latest NVIDIA drivers. The  result was that the NVIDIA HD Audio driver was enabled when I plugged in the TV to the HDMI port. Here are the screenshots of the configuration.

As you can see, the drivers are correctly installed and the sound over HDMI is fully functioning with the same levels of NVIDIA drivers that were installed on the P70. I have to assume that the issue is the HDMI setup on the P70 via the Thunderbolt firmware is faulty. This will need to be addressed to correct probably by another firmware/software update.

 

      

 


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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  • Message 37 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-25, 15:36 PM

OK, now for the next glitch! I changed the display adapter in the BIOS to Discrete after insuring that the lastest Lenovo graphics driver updates were installed. After starting up the system I ran the Lenovo Vantage app to determine if there were any updates to be installed. System update offered me the already installed NVIDIA drivers again (remember I had already insured that the system was properly updated before switching). I decided to let the install proceed, but the installation hung for a long time. I finally cancelled out and rebooted the system. Nothing had been updated (I didn't expect that there would be a change), but system update continued to offer me a new set of drivers. This time I declined.

 

I'm not truly understanding what has been happening with the P1 and discrete graphics, but something is still wrong if system update persists in asserting that I need new drivers for the NVIDIA P2000 adapter. This never happened on my P70 when I applied the NVIDIA updates from Lenovo when in discrete mode, so I can only assume that the script which was attempting to run for the install was looking for the Intel 630 adapter which was not enabled so it hung. Again, this should be rectified.


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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2458 Posts

06-13-2013

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  • Message 38 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-25, 22:27 PM

Wait... two posts above from you I thought you had installed the offered driver update after (1) updating the P1 BIOS to 1.17, and then (2) switching to discrete graphics, and only then installing the driver update.  And the screenshots you took were the result, and they definitely show only one graphic adapter Nvidia (so you clearly were in discrete graphics) and the other driver versions look good.  I note that the NVidia HD Audio driver is shown now as 1.3.37.5 which is the same as offered directly through NVidia as their latest version, and is newer than the 1.3.37.4 offered by Lenovo in the 398.36/1.3.37.4 package for the P70 that we have been fighting with.

 

And now one post above from you you say you only switched to discrete graphics after ensuring that the driver update had gone successfully. That would imply you were still in hybrid graphics when you actually did the driver update.  But your Device Manager screenshot in your first post definitely shows discrete and not hybrid, with the other items correct.  I'm confused.  Did you re-boot again after the situation captured by your first post, and it was after this second re-boot that Vantage re-offered you the driver update you'd already previously installed again?

 

So, please clarify.  After updating the P1 BIOS to 1.17 were you still in hybrid, and did you then install the drivers (successfully I'm sure), and then changed to discrete, and then re-booted for the first time, and then you took your screenshots?  Or did you switch to discrete right after updating the BIOS to 1.17, and then you installed the drivers while now in discrete, and then you took your screenshots, seemingly showing success?  Are you out of the woods as far as HDMI audio is concerned, and your only issue now is that you have a new Vantage problem of re-offering you the drivers which actually are now installed (perhaps as you suggest because the Intel HD 630 is not seen in discrete mode)?

 

So forgettng for the moment about a Vantage issue, are you actually in discrete graphics at the moment with some 411.xx version of Nvidia graphics installed along with 1.3.37.5 NVidia HD Audio, and you still have that "good" situation shown by your screenshots?  In other words are you now running with a 411.xx NVidia driver plus 1.3.37.5 Nvidia HD Audio driver with your 1.17 BIOS and you DO still have HDMI audio available to the TV because the NVidia devices are shown in Playback Devices as your screenshot shows?

 

If so, then I suggest it has at least something to do with some correction in 411.xx of the NVidia graphics driver and 1.37.7.5 of the NVidia HD Audio driver in the package for the P1, vs. the 398.36/1.37.7.4 of those components in the package for the P70... perhaps muddied up a bit by the clearly signifigant requirement for first installing the 1.17 BIOS update in the P1 specifically to fix a critical "bricking" problem when changing from hybrid to discrete (words which are central to our P70 story as well).

 

Lenovo... we have a problem.

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2217 Posts

04-20-2008

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  • Message 39 of 91

Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-25, 23:58 PM

I had installed the latest NVIDIA update as documented while I was on 1.15. I installed BIOS 1.17 this morning and checked that hybrid was still functioning correctly. I then changed to discrete mode and checked again that the NVIDIA Audio driver was still installed when I connected my TV to the P1. Sorry for any confusion of the sequence. The NVIDIA installation had already been performed when in hybrid mode. The same driver set would NOT install when in discrete mode for the reasons documented previously.

 

The P70 is still broken in discrete mode for HDMI audio, but works correctly when in hybrid mode. There is definitely a problem with the P70, but I'm not certain that it is the NVDIA driver based on the behavior of what I see when I plug in the HDMI cable. Windows 10 1809 definitely sees the TV for video, but not to have audio capability. It's definitely an issue with the P70 and audio detection. Whether the NVIDIA driver is the issue is uncertain. I did try to install the .5 HD driver on the P70 separately, but it made no difference in audio capability. I do believe that it is related to how the HDMI capability is implented on the P70.


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.23 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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Re: Latest NVidia Graphics drivers with 1.3.37 HD Audio driver: no NVidia HD Audio device gets insta

2018-12-26, 3:16 AM

Ok. You've clarified everything.

 

And it does look like the P70 has BIOS problems somewhere, either with its HDMI implementation or its hybrid/discrete implementation, or both, or more.  Certainly there were P1 BIOS "bricking" issues with hybrid/discrete and the 1.17 fix addressed that, and might also actually include the [unknown] fix for the HDMI audio issue since you're now running on the P1 with discrete and have no HDMI audio problem as we do on the P70.  You never could test if there even was an HDMI audio on the P1 with discrete since you couldn't leave hybrid until 1.17 BIOS came out.  Or... again... it might be something Nvidia did with 1.3.37.5. But remember I first installed 411.95/1.3.37.5 from Nvidia on my own P70 and it broke HDMI audio, so it doesn't suggest the same exact graphics/audio driver would now work on your P1 with HDMI audio unless the BIOS 1.17 fix for hybrid/discrete was somehow relevant to this "solution" at least for the P1.

 

Anyway, whatever turns out to be the story on the P70, this is not from something we're doing.  It's real.  The existing P70 BIOS 2.27 may have an HDMI or Thunderbolt problem and/or the same or similar hybrid/discrete issue the P1 had (although it doesn't brick the P70 to switch to discrete) , but whatever its condition it does NOT cause HDMI audio to fail with all releases of Nvidia driver packages that include 1.3.36.6 HD Audio.  These ALL WORK FINE WITH HDMI AUDIO.

 

If there is something "latently problematic" in the P70 BIOS which is responsible for the new failing HDMI audio in discrete, it only appears to come out of hiding due to an Nvidia driver package that includes 1.3.37.x HD audio.

 

I had brought NC Lenovo's attention to this last week, but because of the upcoming holiday the only thing that had been determined so far (i.e. before they were disappearing until after New Years when they promised to resume looking into it) is what we also now know to be true, namely that as long as we have the P70 and P1 in hybrid mode everything works fine with the old 1.3.36.3 driver as well as with the new 1.3.37.x driver sets that also include newer graphics.  You can install successfully while in hybrid, and you can operate successfully while in hybrid, including having that HD Audio object remain in Device Manager and Playback Devices.  HDMI audio works just fine, all machines, with hybrid active.

 

NC Lenovo hadn't yet gotten to the discrete test with the P70 before they broke for the holiday. When they get back and do their own testing I'm confident they will see the same "no HDMI audio" results we've seen, including the other symptom you discovered with the 398.36/1.37.7.4 installer which is that the new "NVidia virtual audio (WAVE extensible) (WDM)" device doesn't get installed properly if you do the install while in discrete mode although it does get installed if in hybrid mode.  And you mentioned it magically DID get installed if you re-ran the install a second time. And of course it DOES get installed the first time if in hybrid mode.  Unknown what this thing is, but it's definitely brand new with 1.3.37.x.

 

With that, I wish you a happy holiday week.  After New Years the saga continues.  In the meantime I'm sticking with the last NVidia WHQL driver to include 1.3.36.6 (i.e. 392.00/1.3.36.6) on both my P70 and W530.  And everything is problem-free.

 

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