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11-13-2019

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-03, 16:44 PM
How have you identified the details of the touch layer? I'm not questioning if you are correct, I'm just interested to know more about this.

Cheers,
-kyle
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11-05-2019

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-03, 17:05 PM

How have you identified the details of the touch layer? I'm not questioning if you are correct, I'm just interested to know more about this.

If you turn off your screen or turn down the brightness to minimum and look very closely under good lighting conditions, you can see a really thin diagonal grid on the top glass. It's actually the Lenovo technician who came changing my first screen who pointed it out to me.

 

Assuming both our screens have the exact same defect, you can now increase the brightness step by step while looking at that grid until the fabric-like pattern appears. You'll notice that they are perfectly aligned. I believe that if we were able to remove the touch layer without damaging the OLED panel below, the problem would disappear. I won't take the risk though :)

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12-03-2019

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-04, 4:44 AM

Yep the Dell Oled looks great. Lenovo obviously went for the cheaper option....

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-05, 21:32 PM

Hi all,

 

I did a little experiment to confirm my thoughts: that the issue comes from the interference between the pixel arrangement and the touch layer grid.

 

Below is the picture of the pixels of the OLED panel provided by Andy_Lenovo where I highlighted the diagonal arrangement of the pixels.

 

 

 

If we zoom out we end up with a more a less orthogonal grid like this (this is about 100 pixels wide):

 

 

The touch layer grid doesn't have the exact same shape, if you look closely, you'll see that it is flattened (i.e. the diamonds are more wide than tall), like this:

 

 

 

Now, guess what happens if we stack both grids upon each other?

 

 

You can see the interference pattern appearing:

 

 

I don't have the exact size and shape of neither the pixels nor the touch grid but you get the idea: if you stack two grids with different intersection angles, interference artefacts appear. This looks exactly like the "fabric" or mesh pattern that repeats all over my screen. You can see that it is at a much higher scale than subpixels. And we can decrease brightness, it won't go away.

 

So we have a high end laptop with a wonderful OLED panel, but for some obscure reason someone decided to slap a touch layer on top (that BTW hardly no one really needs, this is a laptop not a tablet) with an incompatible grid orientation that creates ugly artefacts and makes the above mentioned wonderful OLED panel worthless.

 

So this is a either a design defect or a poor choice of OLED/touch screen combination together with a severe lack of QA (at least on one production series of this screen). I guess some people just got the chance to get a touch layer from another series that doesn't create this issue.

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-05, 22:21 PM

Excellent analysis!!!


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.25 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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2366 Posts

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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-05, 22:26 PM

Which series do you believe does not have this defect? All of the OLED panels for Lenovo 15.6" are the same p/n. Did you mean another manufacturer??


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.25 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-05, 22:43 PM

 wrote:

Which series do you believe does not have this defect? All of the OLED panels for Lenovo 15.6" are the same p/n. Did you mean another manufacturer??


It's just a guess, but since not every owner of the P1 Gen 2/P53 OLED experience this issue, or maybe not at the same level (e.g. you mentioned that you can see the effect only if you pay attention, while on my screen it is very visible) maybe not all screens are from the same production line despite having the same p/n, and that some may have a different touch layer. Or maybe it comes from a difference of transparency of that touch grid that increases or lessens the issue, idk.

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6 Posts

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  • Message 38 of 138

Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-05, 23:03 PM

I don't know why, but my original post disapeared... Fortunately I had it saved locally.

 

Moderator note: it was snagged by the spam filter - which gets overly cranky at times.  Since you've recovered nicely, I'll leave that earlier version archived.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Hi all,

 

I did a little experiment to confirm my thoughts: that the issue comes from the interference between the pixel arrangement and the touch layer grid.

 

Below is the picture of the pixels of the OLED panel provided by Andy_Lenovo where I highlighted the diagonal arrangement of the pixels.

 

 

 

If we zoom out we end up with a more a less orthogonal grid like this (this is about 100 pixels wide):

 

 

The touch layer grid doesn't have the exact same shape, if you look closely, you'll see that it is flattened (i.e. the diamonds are more wide than tall), like this:

 

 

 

Now, guess what happens if we stack both grids upon each other?

 

 

You can see the interference pattern appearing:

 

 

I don't have the exact size and shape of neither the pixels nor the touch grid but you get the idea: if you stack two grids with different intersection angles, interference artefacts appear. This looks exactly like the "fabric" or mesh pattern that repeats all over my screen. You can see that it is at a much higher scale than subpixels. And we can decrease brightness, it won't go away.

 

So we have a high end laptop with a wonderful OLED panel, but for some obscure reason someone decided to slap a touch layer on top (that BTW hardly no one really needs, this is a laptop not a tablet) with an incompatible grid orientation that creates ugly artefacts and makes the above mentioned wonderful OLED panel worthless.

 

So this is a either a design defect or a poor choice of OLED/touch screen combination together with a severe lack of QA (at least on one production series of this screen). I guess some people just got the chance to get a touch layer from another series that doesn't create this issue.

Reply
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20 Posts

11-13-2019

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  • Message 39 of 138

Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-06, 3:09 AM

I don't have a proper macro setup but...  see attached.  I had to crop and resave :[ to get below the 10mb limit.

 

Please do take care to not introduce resampling artifacts when reviewing the image.  If someone wants to explain how there are artifacts from the camera etc...  maybe.

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  • Message 40 of 138

Re: P1 Gen 2 - Small dots on OLED screen

2019-12-06, 3:16 AM

When I zoom into the image, I can begin to see diagonal dark lines in a portion of the image. Also, it appears that there is a luminance variation from left to right as well. ?


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.25 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

I am not an employee nor an agent of Lenovo.
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