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anmar_rassam
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Message 71 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

Sure I get that, but if it throttles a lot (i.e, the CPU is reducing its clock a lot, that means the machine is not running at its full potential, which leads to my question of: if the CPU clock speed is going to be reduced due to the thermal design, what's the point of providing powerful CPUs for such machines in the first place if they are not going to run at their full potential?

anmar_rassam
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Message 72 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

To follow up on my previous comment, and to give you an example, when I am running CPU stress test on my machine (P1, Xeon E-2176M 12M Cache and up to 4.40GHz, 64GB, 1TB, P2000 4GB GPU), the unit is constantly either doing thermal throttling or power limit throttling and occassionally current limit throttling even when the core temperature doens't exceed 75 Deg C, this has the effect of not allowing the core frequency to go above 2.9GHz (even though theoretially it should go up to 4.40GHz or there about) whilst fan is working most of the time. I have also tried undervolting the core with an offset of -135mV. Any clue why please? Is it time to repasting the CPU and GPU in this case?

Thanks.

OliverK1
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Message 73 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise


@anmar_rassam wrote:

To follow up on my previous comment, and to give you an example, when I am running CPU stress test on my machine (P1, Xeon E-2176M 12M Cache and up to 4.40GHz, 64GB, 1TB, P2000 4GB GPU), the unit is constantly either doing thermal throttling or power limit throttling and occassionally current limit throttling even when the core temperature doens't exceed 75 Deg C, this has the effect of not allowing the core frequency to go above 2.9GHz (even though theoretially it should go up to 4.40GHz or there about) whilst fan is working most of the time. I have also tried undervolting the core with an offset of -135mV. Any clue why please? Is it time to repasting the CPU and GPU in this case?

Thanks.

 

Does it really makes sense? I think it does not...

Do people buy it? Yes.

Isit marginally still better then a lower clocked CPU? Maybe.

Is it an optimal price\performance spensing? I don't think so.


Have a look at these reviews, they show detailed data.

They say the 4K model had 3h less battery life in the WiFi test.

They also say the clock speed of the CPU maxes out at 2.9 GHz at sustained loads, for instant uses it can peak above 4GHz.

 

The advantages of i7 over the i5 is the 6 cores Vs. 4 cores, if your application can use it, it is really a benefit. For example many video editors can improve until 8 cores when rendering (more cores have no more benefit yet), but most photo editors don't exploit it much, single core clock speed is more important for them than cores.

 

From your use case list, I think the 3D work can make use of the dedicated GPU, and the Quadro certified drivers. Do you want to spec your machine to a small occasionally used application, or do you sacrifice the small use case and spec it for the 90% use case?

 

Another advantage of Quadro is that they can output true 10bit colour for color graded screens (their price starts at 1500 Euro plus), which I do take advantage of with my screen, but most screens work with 8 bit.

 

Otherwise for video editing, the GTX card would be better, and actually the P2000 is my limiting factor in video rendering times, when the machine runs for 2-3h on full speed and full fans when exporting the final version of the movie in DaVinci Resolve.

 

A desktop machine would be cheaper and faster for this, but I only do it 1-2x months, and is ok for me to use my laptop for it.

 

For my video editor, Capture One Pro, the GPU is not exploited much.

 

At the desk, I use the Dell Precision 7530, which is comparable to the Lenovo P52, with a Dual Thunderbolt dock.

 

Istarted with the Lenovo P72 with 4K screen, but it had oversaturated colours in Windows apps, like browser, YouTube, office apps, the keyboard was non standard and annoying for touch type, and the Bios issues with bricking the machine possibly, so I returned it.

 

For on the go, I settled on the X1 Carbon, it's thin and light, good keyboard. I don't do any video render on that (it could, just it would take a day to finish). I would have preferred the Dell XPS 15, but I didn't like the keyboard so much, and the webcam was at an awkward place. The battery was also better on the Carbon.

 

How would it be for programming? I don't know which software do you use, do you run any virtual machines, and how many.

 

I would really look at the videos in my previous post, it would take you only 1-2h of youtube, and you would have more clarity.

 

Https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-X1-Extreme-i7-4K-HDR-GTX-1050-Ti-Max-Q-Laptop-Review.3...

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-X1-Extreme-i5-FHD-GTX-1050-Ti-Max-Q-Laptop-Review.3395...

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Dell-XPS-15-2018-9570-8300H-GTX-1050-97Wh-Laptop-Review.308420.0.html

 

Do you want a 15" screen over 14"?

Then your only choice is the X1E and P1 {or any similar model from Dell, HP, Razor).

 

For the Xeon and the Quadro, if you don't know that you need it, probably you don't. Those users who need it usually have it in the spec list of their software, so they cannot go with anything else. You can still use it of course, but you spend for something that you don't take advantage of.

 

The Linus video on the Xeon is also very informative.

 

anmar_rassam
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Message 74 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

Thanks again @OliverK1 for your response, very useful.

In terms of programming, I use all kind of programming, from embedded programming using various IDEs (some need to run on VMs), I use Micosoft Visual Studio, I use Android Studio, plus others. Plus I tend to do some PCB design work, and plan to do some video editing work (the latter as a hoby).

 

I need to go for a 15" machine as I travel a lot and it's helpful to have a bigger screen to do some technicoal work. I never used MAC and I want to stick with Windows; likewise I don't like the keyboard of Dell XPS 15 and the camera at the bottom too, so my options now are limited between X1E and P1.

 

Also, I have looked into all the links you sent me over a few hours, they are very useful and enjoyable too, thanks a lot for those.

 

Some more questions please:

 

1. Do you think I will gain a lot of value by repasting the CPU and GPU? I can do it with no issue it's just worth asking the question before I go ahead and actuall do it.

 

2. I tried to undervolt the core using Intel ETU for a value of -135mV and I accepted/saved the changes, but everytime I restart my machine and open the utility again, it shows the default settins of 0V offset. How could I get it to actually store it and take effect?

 

3. As for the display whether to go for FHD or UHD, in order to preserver battery life (which is important for me) and I am not really bothered about the "touch screen" element, I will aim to go for FHD. However, would 300 nits not be too low in comparison to other laptops? The one for Macbook Pro is 500 nits, and I cannot judge whether I would even notcie the difference doing my usual daily work.

 

4. I have the power profile configred as "Best Performance" and ran the core stress test, please see attached.

 

a) When it was on idle, just before I started the test (which can be seen as the time before the "CPU Utilisation" trace went high) and after the test was finished (which can be seen as the time after the "CPU Utilisation" trace went down again), the orange trace (which is the core frequency) was at 4.07GHz and at that time the number of Active Core Count was shown as 0. Shouldn't the frequency be closer to 4.4GHz?

 

b) During the test, the frequency dropped down to around 3.7GHz, and as I still have some head room on the temperature, would you expect the frequency to be still higher as you could still push more power through the processor?

 

Many thanks again.

Anmar

OliverK1
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Message 75 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise


@anmar_rassam wrote:

Thanks again @OliverK1 for your response, very useful.

In terms of programming, I use all kind of programming, from embedded programming using various IDEs (some need to run on VMs), I use Micosoft Visual Studio, I use Android Studio, plus others. Plus I tend to do some PCB design work, and plan to do some video editing work (the latter as a hoby).

 

I need to go for a 15" machine as I travel a lot and it's helpful to have a bigger screen to do some technicoal work. I never used MAC and I want to stick with Windows; likewise I don't like the keyboard of Dell XPS 15 and the camera at the bottom too, so my options now are limited between X1E and P1.

 

Also, I have looked into all the links you sent me over a few hours, they are very useful and enjoyable too, thanks a lot for those.

 

Some more questions please:

 

1. Do you think I will gain a lot of value by repasting the CPU and GPU? I can do it with no issue it's just worth asking the question before I go ahead and actuall do it.

 

According to the other forum posts here (make a search, this was discussed extensively), they say the thermals are better, throttling is better, and fan noise is more tolerable.

If any of the above is bothering you, a well done manual repaste can help to improve over the factory repaste.

I hate fan noise, so for me this was a selection criteria that the machine is silent when idle and when doing office tasks, and that the fan noise has not-disturbing sound when on full load.

 

How is the fan noise for you now?

Are you ok with it?

 

https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-X-Series-Laptops/X1-Extreme-Heat-Issue/td-p/4262857

 

https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/forums/searchpage/tab/message?filter=location&q=x1e&location=forum-boar...

 

For the Dell XPS the user base is larger, and it has been well tested and documented, and beside the CPU, some other components also overheat on the motherboard, and adhesive thermal pads help to transfer the heat to the chassis.

 

If the machine is fine for you as it is, and you fear you would damage something, I wouldn't bother.

 

If you like to learn about your machine, do some experimenting with hardware, exploit all what is present in the hardware, I would do it. I plan to use my machine for the next 3 years minimum, maybe 5, so I like to optimise everything in the beginning of the lifecycle.

 

2. I tried to undervolt the core using Intel ETU for a value of -135mV and I accepted/saved the changes, but everytime I restart my machine and open the utility again, it shows the default settins of 0V offset. How could I get it to actually store it and take effect?

 

Have a look on Throttle Stop, and maybe ask the questions in their forum, and report back here if you found the answer.

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/the-throttlestop-guide.531329/

 

3. As for the display whether to go for FHD or UHD, in order to preserver battery life (which is important for me) and I am not really bothered about the "touch screen" element, I will aim to go for FHD. However, would 300 nits not be too low in comparison to other laptops? The one for Macbook Pro is 500 nits, and I cannot judge whether I would even notcie the difference doing my usual daily work.

 

The P1 FHD screen is 300 nits, the 4K screen is 400 nits.

 

My Sony SVS13 from 2013 has only 225 nits, and it was fine for me in the past six years. The only times I complained and wanted more screen brightness was when I wanted to use it in the summer outside sitting in park, but this happened only 3 times in my life. I think 300 nits is fine for most tasks. Inside, or in the eveing, I find even the max brightness to be

 

At which brightness level do you use your P1 currently?

 

Are you using 100% brightness?

 

If you will use the laptop a lot outside, then higher brightness can make the difference. I almost never use my laptop outside, the only times when I need higher brightness when I make long train journeys, I sit next to the window, and there is no curtain.

 

My work laptop is a Fujitsu Lifebook E736. It has a "whopping" 13.3-inch screen with 1,366 x 768, 350:1, and 200 cd/m² (=nits). The comfortable brightness level for me on that machine is 60-70% indoors. I use it for two years now, crunching countless hours of productivity work on it.

 

Of course, for battery life the brightness matters, by lowering your brightness, you get a lot of battery power back.

 

The other advantage of the higher brightness is for editing photo and video, to have enough brightness to show highlights and dark areas, against the strong environmental light, and is a necessity. If you are typing white text on a black screen, this doesn't matter.

 

But for sure the 4K screen looks nicer, but for the type of work you mention, it will be only feel nicer, but I don't think your work

 

Can you get a similar machine next to yours and compare?

 

4. I have the power profile configred as "Best Performance" and ran the core stress test, please see attached.

 

a) When it was on idle, just before I started the test (which can be seen as the time before the "CPU Utilisation" trace went high) and after the test was finished (which can be seen as the time after the "CPU Utilisation" trace went down again), the orange trace (which is the core frequency) was at 4.07GHz and at that time the number of Active Core Count was shown as 0. Shouldn't the frequency be closer to 4.4GHz?

 

Actually, this is how the CPU is supposed to work.

 

With better cooling, undervolting, repasting, the CPU can run at a higher frequency.

 

This is where the small case of the P1 is limiting sooner, the P52 and P72 can crunch out more power from the same CPU due to better colling. The CPU speed is dynamically adjusted depending on the temperature (and others), so the better you carry away heat, the longer it will maintain the higher speeds.

 

A better use case would be to look for the CPU benchmarking software that is closer to your use case, and run 10-15x one after the other. This will give you a better view of the thermal capabilities. Ex. I was running CineBench 15 times, and checked how it performs. Then the chassis will be sufficiently heated up, and will simulate more a long video rendering.

 

However, as you have the machine in your hands now, just simulate all the typical CPU heavy tasks that you have now. I was exporting standard video  clips in DaVinci Resolve, and checked how it performs.

 

https://www.extremetech.com/computing/273917-cpu-throttling

 

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Impact-of-Temperature-on-Intel-CPU-Performance-606/

 

b) During the test, the frequency dropped down to around 3.7GHz, and as I still have some head room on the temperature, would you expect the frequency to be still higher as you could still push more power through the processor?

 

Many thanks again.

Anmar


If battery is really that important to you, I would go for the lower specced i7. Probably not the i5, because you need the two extra cores for the virtual machines. It sounds to me that the dedicated GPU won't be used 95% of the time in your machine, so I would choose whatever is the lowest possible. Do you know if any of your apps benefit from a dedicated GPU / more cuda cores?

 

As for myself, I also like the 15" format to work on.

If you really want a 15 machine that is both very performing and portable, maybe you will be better off with a ThinkPad P52?

 

For the P52 you can also buy extra batteries, so you just bring and swap in a second battery and you have double battery life.

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-P52-i7-P1000-FHD-Workstation-Review.322974.0.html#toc-...

 

Otherwise, I still think Razor made the best 15" laptop with these CPUs. See a comparison here.

https://youtu.be/V4oKGg9yUzc?t=315

 

If you run virtual machines, I would also upgrade to the Samsung 970 Pro SSDs, that will make them load and write the state back to the disc faster. Maybe that would give you more sense of a "fast machine" in everyday use than a tiny bit faster CPU.

 

My P72 came with a middle-class Intel SSD, it had read times near the Samsung 970 Evo, but the write speeds were significantly lower.

 

Otherwise, have a look also on the E580. It has a U series CPU, but otherwise it has probably the longest battery life of the 15" models.

https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-e-series/ThinkPad-E580/p/20KSS0MW00

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-E580-i5-8250U-UHD-620-SSD-Laptop-Review.289954.0.html#...

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anmar_rassam
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Message 76 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

That is great @OliverK1, thanks for your response. Answers to your quesitons are (your quotes are highlighed in green):

 

1. How is the fan noise for your now? Are you OK with it?

[Answer] I don't get the electrical sound which is good, however what bothers me is that that fan comes On most of times, even when the laptop is sitting idle doing nearly nothing and the temperauter is around 50 Deg C (these conditions when the laptop is running on mains and at "Best Performance" settings), which is not good at all and very annoying too. Even my 8-year Dell laptop (i7-2760QM) performs better is this sense and runs much quieter. I don't understand, even if a machine is configured as  best performance, why a fan would come on if the laptop is barely doing anything and hte temperature is cool. Without trying to change the settings in a way that may compromose the performance, Is there a way to control this better?

 

2. Based on your statement "I hate fan noise, so for me this was a selection criteria that the machine is silent when idle and when doing office tasks, and that the fan noise has not-disturbing sound when on full load.", which machine did you end up taking/using that satisified your mentioned crieteria pleae?

 

3. At which brightness level do you use your P1 currently? Are you using 100% brightness?

[Answer] I am happy with 90% brightness level. Based on this, do you think the FHD 300 nits will be sifficient enough?

 

4. What about the screen resolution, surely on 15" screen FHD is more than enough and anything more than this could not be detected/spotted by human-being eyes, and therefore UHD may not be noticed, no?

 

5. Do you know if any of your apps benefit from a dedicated GPU / more cuda cores?

[Anmar] I am not sure, how could I check this? I am planning to do much more creative work (normally family-puprposes photo and video editing) plus I may do some simple 3D redenring for PCB designs, so in my mind I currently have the budget and I would rather have something that will provide me with future proof in case I need it as this machine I am planning to keep for the next 5 to 7 years (at least).

 

6. If you really want a 15 machine that is both very performing and portable, maybe you will be better off with a ThinkPad P52?

[Answer] If both the P52 and P1 are using the same components (same processor, RAM, SSD, etc), why woudl the P52 perform better? is this because the case is larger, the thermal behaviour is better and therefore allowing the unit to push more power? I haven't seen P52 before, my drawback on the P52 just be reviewing its spec is that it's thicker and heavier than the P1 or X1E (245mm vs 184mm) and (2.45Kg vs 1.7Kg) respectively, also the battery life is quoted to be less (10 horus vs 13 hours) when tested under the same/Lenovo conditions (even though they may not be practical on the daily usage, but this provides an apple-to-apple comparison).

 

Ultimately, I want a machine that has enough power to run heave workloads and to allow me to be compatible for future work I may undertake, portable, and not noisy (i.e., fan not running all the time) when I run normal daily tasks whereby other machines (even slimmer) manage to be pretty quiet.

 

Thanks again.

 

 

TheRealHydrogen
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Message 77 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

 

In brief, we have reached a point in portable computing where the laws of physics, specifically the boundaries of thermal dynamics, are being reached.

 

We want our cake (a fast computer) and eat it too (thin, light and portable).

 

These H series (high performance) processors give off more heat per square inch than their predecessors; and more than their low voltage ultrabook counterparts.

 

You will either have a laptop with more fan noise, or you will have a throttling chip, or you will have suboptimal performance.  You can't have it all.

 

Here's what I did and my reasons for doing so...   

 

After purchasing and returning an X1 Carbon Gen 6 (due to issues with it overheating), and two T480s laptops (due to a crappy keyboard I ended up with on the first one a loud Coil Whine on the second), I ended up purchasing a P1 at the advice of the Lenovo Premier Support representative's advice.  He suggested either an X1 Extreme or something in the P series to replace my aging W series workstation grade laptop because, and I quote, "we have the least amount of complaints and returns with our P series machines."  He refused to clarify or expand upon it.  I believe it is because the components are of higher quality or machined to tighter tolerances.

 

After having used the X1C6 and two T480s units, I can attest to this.   None of these three laptops' USB ports were smooth and easy to insert/remove USB sticks.  The P1 is like butter.  The way it should be.  Things just plug in and unplug without a struggle.  The keyboard is awesome. 

 

The FHD screen in my P1 is great, crisp, bright enough and I am very happy with it after struggling with WQHD screen scaling while docking/undocking issues I had with the previous three ThinkPads.  This is a Windows problem, not a Lenovo problem.  I experience the same with my Surface Pro 5th Gen which I purchased while waiting a month for my P1 to ship, but got such a good deal from Costco I decided to keep the Surface because it is so small and lightweight I prefer it for short trips or visiting customer sites (I am a consultant).

 

Screen Scaling sucks in Windows 10.  They need to get it resolved.  The additional battery life and this scaling issue are the  reasons why I decided to get a FHD over a 4K, plus the glossy screen adds to my eyestrain and fatigue as evidenced in my use of the Surface.  So the antiglare of the FHD screen is welcomed.

 

For getting more serious work done like development in Visual Studio, and such, the P1 is the way to go for me because no Surface or Carbon can get to 32GB of RAM (or 64 in a future upgrade) where I can run VMs and do things on the primary OS.  Also, if I ever go on an extended trip, the 15" display of the P1 is better for me than the 12" of the Surface, or 14" of the Carbon or T series.

 

The reason I went with P1 vs P52 is the size but also the keyboard.  P52 has the numeric keypad built-in which I rarely use and I don't care of the offset typing nature this creates.  I experienced it on a 17" HP Elitebook and said, never again.

 

Finally, I chose the P1 over the X1E because the reality is I have seen more GeForce machines blue screen and crash than Quadro based NVidia GPUs.  In fact, knock on wood, my ThinkPad W520 with Quadro from 2011 has *never* blue screened.  I believe the third party ISV certification requirements for Quadro demand more scrutiny in testing of the hardware, firmware and drivers for stability.

 

I chose the P2000 Quadro over the P1000 because it's gaming performance is almost on-par with the X1E GeForce GPU's.

 

Hope this helps!

-Darius

anmar_rassam
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Message 78 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

Thanks Darius for this (@TheRealHydrogen), very helpful analysis and way of thinking. A couple of questions:

1. Looking into previous posts, did you have the X1E to start? Did you use and then ended up replacing with P1 and therefore you have a practical experience on the difference between the two?

2. What is the processor on your P1 machine?

3. Do you get overheat, thermal throttling and/or fan working most of the time when laptop is configured as "high performance" even when it is not doing that much?

4. Lastly, what kind of battery life do you get our your mahcine? Mine (P1, Xeon, 64GB, 1T) achieves no more than 5 hours (haven't tested it practically though and this is based on the OS indication) when configures at "Best battery life" and at 50% brightness level.

Thanks again, and happy new year Smiley Happy
anmar_rassam
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Message 79 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

Thanks Darius for this (@TheRealHydrogen), very helpful analysis and way of thinking. A couple of questions:

1. Looking into previous posts, did you have the X1E to start? Did you use and then ended up replacing with P1 and therefore you have a practical experience on the difference between the two?

2. What is the processor on your P1 machine?

3. Do you get overheat, thermal throttling and/or fan working most of the time when laptop is configured as "high performance" even when it is not doing that much?

4. Lastly, what kind of battery life do you get our your mahcine? Mine (P1, Xeon, 64GB, 1T) achieves no more than 5 hours (haven't tested it practically though and this is based on the OS indication) when configures at "Best battery life" and at 50% brightness level.

Thanks again, and happy new year Smiley Happy

TheRealHydrogen
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Message 80 of 94

Re: Brandnew Thinkpad P1 with coil-whining like noise

Thanks Darius for this (@TheRealHydrogen), very helpful analysis and way of thinking. A couple of questions:

1. Looking into previous posts, did you have the X1E to start? Did you use and then ended up replacing with P1 and therefore you have a practical experience on the difference between the two?

 

No, I did not have the X1E - I had the X1C Gen 6 14" Ultrabook.  While I did not mention this, I actually DID have an order placed for an X1E which I canceled the next morning due to my hestitation of going against the Lenovo Premier Support representative's advice to get a P series machine combined with my experience of BSoD (Blue Screen of Death)'s on GeForce vs Quadro GPU (never BSoD'd).


2. What is the processor on your P1 machine?

 

It is the i7-8850H vPro hexacore.  The reason I purchased this CPU is because I want the option to have as high a *base* clock rate as possible.  I would have considered the Xeon you purchased, but my budget would not permit me to stretch that far.  And if I did get the Xeon, I would have forced myself to purchase ECC memory as I have for my server.  Xeon's, contrary to what you will hear individuals state here on the forums that they are "essentially the same chip" is not true.  I know from a conversation I had with a childhood friend whom I went to school with that had worked at Intel engineering on the CPUs this is not the entire story.  My friend advised that Xeon processors are designated as such because they were cuts from the silicone which exceed a threshold of testing even though they are made on the same die as i7's in this generation we are discussing.  They are cuts which can tolerate higher clocks and permit them to factory 'enable' (or 'expose') more L1 cache.

3. Do you get overheat, thermal throttling and/or fan working most of the time when laptop is configured as "high performance" even when it is not doing that much?

 

The fan does come on frequently and is at times louder.  The latest BIOS and power management drivers from Lenovo made it better.  I can't say it is any more frequent than my outgoing W series ThinkPad which the fan tends to run non-stop.  The differnece here is the P1 and X1E both exhaust their fan outputs mostly up towards the display (vs out the side or back of the machine) and since higher pitched sounds travel up vertically combined with the screen surface to reflect them right into our ears, we hear it more.  Plus, there are two fans vs. one like my W series so more fans, more CFMs, more noise.  I do not get throttling, but I do not use it for 3D rendering and do not use it for continuous workloads.

 

**NOTE: Even my mother's new i5 P1 which I purchased and setup for her to replace her old T510 machine exhibits fan noise.  It may be somewhat less frequent than my i7, but you can still hear it more than a typical machine because again, the fans are exhausting upward toward the screen on both the X1E and P1.

4. Lastly, what kind of battery life do you get our your mahcine? Mine (P1, Xeon, 64GB, 1T) achieves no more than 5 hours (haven't tested it practically though and this is based on the OS indication) when configures at "Best battery life" and at 50% brightness level.

 

I get about 7.5 to 8 hours doing Outlook, occaissional browsing, Excel, etc.  If I were to be continuously building/compiling within Visual Studio probably 3.5-4.

Thanks again, and happy new year 

 

You're welcome!  Happy New Year to you.  I think you need to decide what you are doing.  You've gone back and forth with a lot of replies and a lot of feedback, but I sense you are not content with the machine.  That's how I was with the previous models I purchased.  Something didn't feel right to me.  Maybe you don't need a Xeon with 64GB of memory?  Maybe an i7 or an i5 even is sufficient?  The i5 H series processors are "not your father's CPU" they are quite fast base and turbo clocks.

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