cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Reply
nvsnow
SCSI Port
Posts: 77
Registered: ‎11-09-2019
Location: US
Views: 676
Message 61 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?


@SvenDJ wrote:

 

 

Once, I tried to deinstall (remove!) Power Mangement, APS and cooling stuff in the device manager (system components), but then my windows did not even boot any more, so, that wasn't a solution.

 

 


Before trying this, Create a Restore Point. 

 

EDIT - This forced Windows into recovery mode and had to restore. 

 

1. Open Services

2. Edit properties for ApsInsSvc (APS Install Service) and  Startup type = Disabled

3. Open Device Manager

4. Right-click System / Lenovo Active Protection System Driver. Select Uninstall and Delete Driver Software for this Device.

 

When rebooting, device will no longer be shown in device manager. However, I don't think this solved the thermal capping problem. 

Community SeniorMod
Community SeniorMod
Posts: 7,727
Registered: ‎01-13-2008
Location: US
Views: 673
Message 62 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?


@lenovotv wrote:

What Linux legacy boot issue is that?


The one described in the README.


The large print: please read the Community Participation Rules before posting. Include as much information as possible: model, machine type, operating system, and a descriptive subject line. Do not include personal information: serial number, telephone number, email address, etc.


The fine print: I do not work for, nor do I speak for Lenovo. Unsolicited private messages will be ignored - questions and answers belong in the forum so that others may contribute and benefit. ... GeezBlog

 

  Communities:   English    Deutsch    Español    Português    Русскоязычное    Česká    Slovenská    Українська   Polski    Türkçe    Moto English

SvenDJ
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 11
Registered: ‎12-02-2019
Location: DE
Views: 637
Message 63 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

Hi Martin,
I just installed the Vantage Enterprise Version, but unfortunately in Smart Settings, Intelligent Cooling I CANNOT TURN OFF "Enable Intelligent Cooling", because there is no option for that at all. :-(

There's just Options for Audio. Intelligent Cooling is explained below ("move the slider here and there"), but there is no way to turn the "intelligent" thing off.

It's not just me, it seems: "erik_h  ‎09-06-2019 07:39 AM I stll don't see a way to turn of intelligent power"

 

Without success, I also tried disabling some drivers (Active Protection, Intelligent Thermal), as well as, stopping some services (Intelligent Thermal, PM stuff, Sensor services) - no change: Moving the laptop => lap mode => 789 MHz, no performance. :-(

Highlighted
ve2mrx
802.11n
Posts: 293
Registered: ‎07-07-2019
Location: CA
Views: 576
Message 64 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

Hi SvenDJ,
At this point, I don't know who's fault it is for the missing setting. Around the same time the P53 series came out and Windows 10 1903/1909 came out.

For sure I wouldn't use 1909 as it's barely out of beta (or if you prefer, it's in user beta now!) and 1903 doesn't have a wide install base yet (making comparing machines difficult). And 1803 is very close to EOL. That leaves 1809. Thank Microsoft for this simplicity!!!

And, so far, I heard if nobody who installed 1809 on the P53 so I don't know if it is Windows or the P53 that removed the setting. Add on top the fact that the P53 is fresh in production, you can get bugs in the new drivers, incompatibilities and such. Kinda user beta there too.

That's why I got a P52 a short time before the P53 came out : the bugs had been shaken out of it from what I read here!

Welcome to the magical world of today's complex supply chain electronics! Yeah, that was sarcastic ;-)

At this point, my best suggestion is to make support noise. Open tickets! The squeaky wheel gets the grease!

Martin
I'm a user, NOT a Lenovo employee. If my post helped, consider giving me a Kudos. If I solved your issue, please mark it as Solved.
P52 I7-8750H P1000 FHD 16GB 512GB-SSD 1TB-HDD
SvenDJ
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 11
Registered: ‎12-02-2019
Location: DE
Views: 555
Message 65 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

OK, I tried to submit a ticket, but that didn't work: filled everything, including failure description, model, address, etc. but clicking the submit button did nothing (short hour glass top right, then nothing).

Maybe, the missinc LSC error code is the problem, fake number here does not help. The date field maybe (I also entered stuff there). No success. That's 21st century, support is surely difficult but actually really bad these days.

 

BTW: Here's my text:

After moving the laptop the maschine's performance drops dramatically (down to 786MHz). My hypothesis is, that the "Intelligent Thermal Solution" (ITS) service sets the laptop to "on-lap" mode (to avoid burns or overheating). The problem is, that the laptop does NOT recover from this "on-lap" mode and, hence, the performance stays ultra-low. 

Reproduce: Put and keep(!) CPU under heavy load, move laptop up, tilt it, put it down, slightly hitting the table => CPU speed drops 1GHz or below - bad!
Bad "solution": Restarting the ITS service DIRECTLY brings back performance => working, but bad workaround.
Stopping the ITS service does NOT help (performance ALWAYS low).

Could you please check and fix the responsible component (e.g. the ITS service) -OR- allow users to completely disable this intelligent "on-lap" mode detection? The current Lenovo Vantage does NOT allow me to switch ITS / Intelligent Cooling off. Also old Enterprise version does not allow this for me.

Sigh
Sven

nvsnow
SCSI Port
Posts: 77
Registered: ‎11-09-2019
Location: US
Views: 522
Message 66 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?


@SvenDJ wrote:

Hi guys,

I have the same serious issue with my brand-new P53. The problem is indeed NOT related to any graphics driver or any temporal problem. The cause of the performance drop is ONLY the "intelligent" thermal solution service (ITS), which tries to avoid burns laps in "lap mode".

When you touch your P53, tilt it or just accidentally hit the table the laptop is on, the ITS service will set the laptop to "lap mode" and then the damage is done! From that point on, the laptop will never get performance again.

 

 

 


Bingo. I've noticed this, too and by manually restarting the thermal solution and I can replicate on a regular basis. I use a large lap pad with a cooler so I noticed this a lot! But if I place on a table, it'll still go into throttle mode within minutes.  Definitely a situation I can't tolerate any longer.

 

 

 

 

ThinkpadIL
Token Ring
Posts: 130
Registered: ‎11-12-2019
Location: IL
Views: 477
Message 67 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

Sounds like there is some motion sensor in this machine which reports about movement to the Lenovo Intelligent Cooling driver. Probably the sensor should show up as HID (human interface device) in the Device Manager. If someone wants to experiment, you can try disabling these HID devices one by one to see if you can make it stop reporting about movement. Watch out though as some of these HID devices are probably your mice and keyboards... Just an idea, not necessarily will work but maybe is worth a try. The sensor could also show up under System Devices.

SvenDJ
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 11
Registered: ‎12-02-2019
Location: DE
Views: 464
Message 68 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

Hi ThinkpadIL, thanks for the motivation, but we tried this already. There is, for example the APS driver (in system components not HID), but deactivating that does not help. The sensory information is passed nevertheless or from some other driver. The only help here can come from people actually experimenting with their own device having the same problem themselves and/or from Lenovo people. More ideas welcome, though.

Branagh
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎12-05-2019
Location: DE
Views: 407
Message 69 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?

Hey there,

 

first of all thanks for all the effort of sharing all your attempts to solve the problem. I've got a P53 with an RTX3000 which ran full throttle for a minute or two and then ran on either 300Mhz GPU clock or 800Mhz RAM, reducing overall fps to about 15%. Remarkably, the fan only started spinning when this point was reached, not before.

 

I tried everything and then came across agazpp's suggestion (thanks mate!) to left click the energy symbol in the task bar to set performance from better to best. Now the fan starts working right away, preventing the throttling. So make sure to try that. Well, now I just need to reduce the awful, awful coil whine somehow.

 

But good luck for all those who haven't found a solution yet!

nvsnow
SCSI Port
Posts: 77
Registered: ‎11-09-2019
Location: US
Views: 305
Message 70 of 174

Re: P53 Performance Issues - Thermal/Power Throttling?


@Branagh wrote:

Hey there,

 

first of all thanks for all the effort of sharing all your attempts to solve the problem. I've got a P53 with an RTX3000 which ran full throttle for a minute or two and then ran on either 300Mhz GPU clock or 800Mhz RAM, reducing overall fps to about 15%. Remarkably, the fan only started spinning when this point was reached, not before.

 

I tried everything and then came across agazpp's suggestion (thanks mate!) to left click the energy symbol in the task bar to set performance from better to best. Now the fan starts working right away, preventing the throttling. So make sure to try that. Well, now I just need to reduce the awful, awful coil whine somehow.

 

But good luck for all those who haven't found a solution yet!


Thanks for sharing your experience! This accurately describes the issues the p53 owners are seeing. 

 

Try this to see if the GPU throttling gets stuck. (I'm in Hybrid Mode btw)

 

1. Unplug and continue using in battery mode. I don't know how long to stay in battery mode for a valid test, but I let it go down to 90%. Using any GPU intensive app (benchmark, game etc), the dGPU MemClock speeds will be throttled to 800 MHz 

2. Plug the laptop back in. Does the dGPU MemClock go back to the 1700 MHz speeds or stay at 800?

 

Currently I'm using either GPU-Z or HWiNFO to monitor Nvidia clocks/temps.

And we're back...

Move delayed but still coming

Learn More

Check out current deals!


Shop current deals

Top Kudoed Authors