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joesixgig
802.11n
Posts: 581
Registered: ‎07-20-2009
Location: US
Views: 6,433
Message 1 of 158

Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

This sounds a lot like a prior thread about porblems with BIOS 1.08, but that thread ended up marked as solved, while for me the issue returned on the latest BIOS update to 1.12. My CPU temp got up to 92C without the fan coming on.

 

Conclusion: there still seems to be some kind of condition where the BIOS completely disables all cooling. I think it's the same problem as that earlier thread, and it's clearly not solved. Thankfully it IS possible to get out of this state by rolling back the BIOS version to the one that worked, instructions are posted here and three posts below that for further clarification. 

 

Symptoms: you start noticing that the TPY gets oddly hot during normal use, or it experiences a forced shutdown due to overheating. It's also completely quiet. But: the fan itself is operational because you hear it briefly spin up during cold boot. 

 

Given that LoneSentry mentioned that the problematic BIOS 1.08 did work on second install, there seems to be some 'random' glitch in the update process or in the BIOS. Meanwhile I'm pretty unhappy that I'm having to do continued truobleshooting on this machine. 

 

 

Edit: going to the BIOS update page I saw that a newer BIOS was available (1.13), which you can install without having to disable Secure Rollback. Lo and behold. the fan is working again. The fan started blowing full speed right at the start of the EC flashing procedure. This is NOT a solution though, since this issue seems to have persisted until BIOS 1.12, and I have no reason to believe that it won't reappear on a future update. 

LoneSentry
SCSI Port
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-25-2015
Location: United States
Views: 6,296
Message 2 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

Yep. At revision 1.13 and this is still going on. I have to roll-back BIOS revisions and then roll-forward to get the fan to work again. I've nearly burned myself in tablet mode quite a few times now. I just updated to 1.14 so we'll see how that goes.

paraloid
Core Memory
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎09-23-2013
Location: IT
Views: 6,290
Message 3 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

Well here I am on the new thread as well - and like heck the issue was resolved on the old thread. As mentioned before by myself and others on the other thread, I would update the BIOS, the fan would work for a while, then it would stop again until I updated the BIOS yet again.

HOWEVER, thinking on this, and a variety of other problems I've been having with the TP Yoga (a whole lot - such buggy software), I remembered from my T61 days that the Lenovo System Update software is pretty hit and miss with finding updates. So I went to the Lenovo downloads page for the TP Yoga and indeed found a lot of software not passed onto me by the System Update.

Amongst these was (TA-DA !) a utility "Lenovo Fan Test for Windows". I thought it would be useful to install in any case to test if the fan was operating properly (it was not part of the standard suite of diagnostic tools provided on my computer).

Anyway since I installed it my fan has worked !!! - but only when my computer is plugged in, though this I believe is because I am using Lenovo Power Optimized (Lenovo Power Manager was another software on the site not provided to me via System Update) which I believe relies on passive cooling (throttling back processor) when only battery power is available. But now TpFan works all the time, though only in smart mode, and when I plug in the power to stream a video the computer doesn't reach boiling point and then shut down.

Thinkpads: T40, T61, Yoga 12
LoneSentry
SCSI Port
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-25-2015
Location: United States
Views: 6,274
Message 4 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan


@paraloid wrote:

Well here I am on the new thread as well - and like heck the issue was resolved on the old thread. As mentioned before by myself and others on the other thread, I would update the BIOS, the fan would work for a while, then it would stop again until I updated the BIOS yet again.

HOWEVER, thinking on this, and a variety of other problems I've been having with the TP Yoga (a whole lot - such buggy software), I remembered from my T61 days that the Lenovo System Update software is pretty hit and miss with finding updates. So I went to the Lenovo downloads page for the TP Yoga and indeed found a lot of software not passed onto me by the System Update.

Amongst these was (TA-DA !) a utility "Lenovo Fan Test for Windows". I thought it would be useful to install in any case to test if the fan was operating properly (it was not part of the standard suite of diagnostic tools provided on my computer).

Anyway since I installed it my fan has worked !!! - but only when my computer is plugged in, though this I believe is because I am using Lenovo Power Optimized (Lenovo Power Manager was another software on the site not provided to me via System Update) which I believe relies on passive cooling (throttling back processor) when only battery power is available. But now TpFan works all the time, though only in smart mode, and when I plug in the power to stream a video the computer doesn't reach boiling point and then shut down.


Interesting. My fan diagnostic comes up as unavailable...

LoneSentry
SCSI Port
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-25-2015
Location: United States
Views: 6,267
Message 5 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

One other thing. I decided to change the thermal paste because the CPU temperature at idle was a little high (45-55 C). And look at the state of this:

11391709_975724685800891_4019442844265924358_n.jpg

 

Lenovo's own spec is that 0.2 grams of thermal grease should be applied between the thermal assembly and the die, which is generally accepted to be the size of a grain of rice before spreading. In other words, a thin layer to help eliminate air gaps between heatspreader and die. What we have here is not 0.2 grams. It's like someone at the factory had a whole tube full of it and just kind of squirted it on there.

 

Anyways, cleaned it with IPA and cleanroom wipes, applied a rice-grain sized dot of Gelid GC Extreme, spread it out just like in the manual, added some thermal pads to the DRAM packages while I was in there and put it all back together. Temperature dropped down to a comfortable 38 - 40 C. So, kudos for detailed hardware manual and for not gluing anything together, points off for sloppy execution.

paraloid
Core Memory
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎09-23-2013
Location: IT
Views: 6,261
Message 6 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

Do you mean running the exe  gives fan unavailable ? I must admit I just realised I don't get any result at all when I run the app! Maybe it was the last BIOS update which  fixed mine.

Thinkpads: T40, T61, Yoga 12
joesixgig
802.11n
Posts: 581
Registered: ‎07-20-2009
Location: US
Views: 6,203
Message 7 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

Looks like my CPU hit 98C again just now. I don't even know when the fan stopped working, and I don't recall doing a BIOS update. This is getting aggravating. 

 

Edit: I have no idea why the fan stopped working, but running system update it found BIOS 1.14. I installed this, and just as before, at the start of the EC flashing the fan starte blowing. Right now the CPU temp is 50C, still high, but at least the fan is working. This is a pretty terrible state of affairs though: the system (the EC?) can go in a funk and stop cooling, and only a BIOS update or rollback fixes the issue. PLEASE FIX THIS!   Smiley Sad

LoneSentry
SCSI Port
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-25-2015
Location: United States
Views: 6,201
Message 8 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan


@paraloid wrote:

Do you mean running the exe  gives fan unavailable ? I must admit I just realised I don't get any result at all when I run the app! Maybe it was the last BIOS update which  fixed mine.


This is what I mean.

 

durp.PNG

trpenny
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 11
Registered: ‎06-22-2015
Location: Nebraska
Views: 6,163
Message 9 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan

I had this same exact problem with my brand new TP Yoga 12. Lenovo replaced my TP Yoga 12 and now I have the exact same problem again. Overheats!!!! BIOS updated and the fan will run for a while and then completely stops. I'm new to the forum. How can we get Lenovo to answer this problem?

LoneSentry
SCSI Port
Posts: 30
Registered: ‎04-25-2015
Location: United States
Views: 6,147
Message 10 of 158

Re: Thinkpad Yoga 12 BIOS update disables cooling fan


@trpenny wrote:

I had this same exact problem with my brand new TP Yoga 12. Lenovo replaced my TP Yoga 12 and now I have the exact same problem again. Overheats!!!! BIOS updated and the fan will run for a while and then completely stops. I'm new to the forum. How can we get Lenovo to answer this problem?


I'm curious, what processor are you using? It seems only those with the i7 are affected. I've never seen anyone with an i5 or i3 complain about this. It's a shame really, the priciness of the upgrade makes us the biggest victims but also puts us squarely in the minority.

 

Lenovo did in fact look into this once, but they were unable to reproduce the symptoms. I incorrectly assumed back then that rolling the BIOS back resolved it, and they took that as resolution.

 

Call me crazy, but looking at all the recent BIOS changelogs, I'd say Lenovo is having some problems with Broadwell's sleep states. Given that Lenovo is probably just pulling any unit for their testing, and that unit has a fresh image, that might explain their inability to reproduce the issue.

 

I wonder if never putting the TPY into sleep or hibernate or perhaps a simple restart with the recent BIOS revisions will fix this issue. I guess next time the fan fails again I'll find out, but at this point I'm considering welding another heatpipe to the heatsink or maybe epoxying my notebook cooler to the bottom of this thing.

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