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7 Posts

08-26-2012

USA

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-07, 2:11 AM

Here's a written and video review. Looking good so far...

 

http://www.thinkscopes.com/blog/2015/01/06/lenovo-thinkpad-x1-carbon-gen-3-review-2

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215 Posts

07-31-2013

United States of America

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-08, 12:55 PM

Well, now that the physical buttons are back, if as they claim in their video ("We listened to our customers"), if they will also be dumping the garbage LG screens and stick with AUO or better screens, I "may" try one of their laptops again.  I returned my T440s with the horrible LG screen.

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9 Posts

01-23-2015

Afghanistan

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-23, 11:12 AM

One of the problems of Lenovo is that they probably have less IT powerusers that use laptops, compared to IBM. IBM was full with professional programmers, IT people etc that all could give feedback about the Thinkpad laptops directly to IBM. But Lenovo has to read the community to get feedback, which is less direct form of feedback.

 

But it's great to see that Lenovo finally listened to their customers by implementing physical trackPOINT buttons. But we are not there yet, the physical trackPAD buttons are still missing.

 

In my opinion, the direction that Lenovo should take is to always follow:

a Form Follows Function philosophy

and never follow a

Form Over Function philosophy.

 

What they did with the buttonless trackpad was a pure form of Form Over Function. Yes, I agree that buttonless looks a bit nicer, but Thinkpads customers aren't people that are looking for nice looking laptops, they are looking for productive workhorses to maximize their productivity at work, laptops do their function at the most productive way that is possible.

 

Reasons to bring physical trackpad buttons back:

  • requires less force to press then a touchpad.
  • physical buttons produce less noise. In a environment with people around you (at home or at work) you don't want to bother others with your mouse clicks, and you don't want to be distracted by the noise of other mouse clicks. Physical buttons usually produce less noise, while fully maintaining physical feedback of a click.
  • easier to perform precision work, because the mouse wont move when pressing the mouse button.
  • easier to perform drap-and-drops. On a buttonless touchpad is problematic when using the index finger: it's difficult to move the mouse cursor while at the same time pressing the touchpad, so you have to stop in between, then press, then move, which lowers productivity and increases frustration. Another approach is to use the index finger to move around and to use the thumb finger to press, but this sometimes leads to accidental mouse cursor moves when using the thumb finger.

Bringing back physical trackpad buttons will reduce the touchpad area, but that's not a problem. Most people only use a small part of the trackpad, like 1/2 to 2/3.

 

At the moment I'm waiting for a Thinkpad with a touchpad with physical buttons to be released, then I'll buy a Thinkpad again.

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48 Posts

01-17-2015

Melbourne, Australia

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-25, 4:36 AM

"Please bring back the physical mouse buttons.

 

Lenovo could easily make this a configuration option to cater to all of their potential customers. I believe there would be strong sales for the configurations that include physical mouse buttons. I simply cannot bring myself to buy another ThinkPad because of this, and it is a shame, because ThinkPads were nearly perfect before this change."

 

Another vote here from me.

 

A couple of observations without reading the whole thread. I'm sure with whatever justification they are coming up with, Lenovo is just trying to converge with other market (keyboard) offerings. This probably just saves them money by sourcing similar parts that are already out there.

 

Another observation. Plenty of good ergonomic items have disappeared from the market. Case in point in is the microsoft trackball explorer. One of the most loved and revered trackballs ever made - discontinued (I believe) for the reason that MS wants to focus on the business of supplying millions (billions?) of mice because that's where the maximum profit is. It's bad for business to make a great item that nobody upgrades. Plenty of other good products have disappeared from the market too.

 

EDIT: Wait.. Looks like their may have been some success with some physical buttons reappearing. But my current comments still stand. I think the trick is to complain loudly and clearly enough, and not give up complaining.

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1 Posts

01-25-2015

Finland

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-25, 7:02 AM

Yeah! Not being able to rest your hand on the buttons is horrible. I want to be able to left click using my thumb, (so i can move the cursor around freely while left clicking) Removing the physical buttons was one of the stupidest designs ever.

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215 Posts

07-31-2013

United States of America

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-25, 12:41 PM

Well I misunderstood about the buttons.  I just assumed they were for both the trackpoint and trackpad, but after reading prosoftx's post I am no longer considering Lenovo products.  I am not a trackpoint fan.

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9362 Posts

01-13-2008

United States of America

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2015-01-25, 12:43 PM

The large print: please read the Community Participation Rules before posting. Include as much information as possible: model, machine type, operating system, and a descriptive subject line. Do not include personal information: serial number, telephone number, email address, etc.


The fine print: I do not work for, nor do I speak for Lenovo. Unsolicited private messages will be ignored - questions and answers belong in the forum so that others may contribute and benefit. ... GeezBlog

 

Communities: English Deutsch Español Português Русскоязычное Česká Slovenská Українська Polski Türkçe Moto English

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10 Posts

04-28-2017

United States of America

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2017-04-28, 19:55 PM

The fact that this thread needs bumping is a bit unnerving. The X1 Carbon, mentioned earlier, still has no physical touchpad buttons. Just the silly nipple-mouse which I never use (hey, more power to 'ya if you enjoy it). I've got a Flex 4 as my work PC, and despite my best efforts to get used to it, it's STILL like computing on sandpaper... cursor movements and clicks are unnatural, I have to put more effort into moving and clicking every little thing. After 10-plus years of working on real touchpads with real buttons, this simply does not sit well.

 

I settled on a T530 about a year ago, because it was the last model not to have a crippled single-piece touchpad and a complete lack of indicator LEDs. However, the T530 is also starting to age out - it's quite heavy and bulky compared to other notebooks. All I want in a new PC is real buttons, and that doesn't need to come at the expense of thickness. The "usable area" argument is bunk (the lost area is just where I press as if it were a button!) and the "gestures" argument is also bunk (they only get in my way and I always disable them - no PC software properly utilizes zoom/rotate in any meaningful way).

 

Plus, plenty of reasons mentioned earlier...

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664 Posts

10-21-2011

Germany

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2017-04-28, 20:53 PM

@FalconFour,

 

see P50, P70 as well as P51 and P71. These four models have physical TouchPad buttons.

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10 Posts

04-28-2017

United States of America

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Re: Please Bring Back Physical Mouse Buttons!

2017-04-28, 23:18 PM

Oh, I was so ready to be excited about that!! Real touchpad buttons on a modern PC?! Yes!!

 

... call me picky, but the situation got more sour the more I looked at those options, the P50 in particular (I like my 15" form factor of the T530).

 

First: it looks like a carbon copy of the T530, just with more modern guts and the speakers in a different place. That's a bit of a bummer because the T530 had already started creeping into non-professional territory. Second, it's just as big and bulky as the T530, which I was hoping to get an improvement over. The keyboard layout leaves proper pgup/pgdn/home/end key layout to be desired, and the minimized-Fn-key labeling really stinks - as well as, of course, the lack of indicator LEDs that made ThinkPads what they are. Can't have everything (back). Oh, and I'm sure the Lenovo Power Manager is gutted as well (my Flex 4 has no more "custom battery threshold" option, for example, though my T530 has it, with the same SW suite/version).

 

So, accepting the trend that everything is just going to get dumbed-down more and more, and generally worse as time goes on, what I would hope is to get a semi-professional laptop (I'm not a CAD guy and I don't even do any real gaming) that simply has modern performance (7th-gen i3, i5, i7), 64-256gb SSD storage (as standard... come on Lenovo, stop selling hard drives, period), 8gb or expandable RAM (onboard + expansion slot is valid!), a respectable 8-10 hour battery life, a good keyboard, a full HD (1920x1080~1200) display, 3x USB 3.0 ports, a headphone jack, Bluetooth, 2.4/5GHz WiFi, a keyboard with F1~F12 keys as primary and Fn+ secondary functions, dedicated volume keys, PgUp/PgDn/Home/End in a solid block, a real Pause key (Fn it with PrtScrn if you like), and good, not-tinny speakers. In a light package. Because I'm not doing CAD and gaming, don't need a hard drive or optical drive, and have basic demands, this shouldn't be hard to make thin-and-light without being stripped of the above features that make it "good". Oh, and TOUCHPAD BUTTONS.

 

Build that, and I'm pretty certain that a whole, whole lot of people will buy it.

 

Apple sells to the common market... those that don't really need professional systems, but want a nice, polished experience stripped down to what-you-need... but the needs/uses of the common Joe are not the same as the experienced PC veterans (that came from DOS, thank you, forum subtitle). Lenovo has an opportunity not to try stealing customers away from Apple's good-for-average-Joe market, but to provide what's missing from the entire PC industry... something that provides new hardware in a package that experienced users are already comfortable with. Instead, we're left searching eBay for used laptops to replace our old PCs because nothing on the modern market suits these wishes.

 

Sorry for the long post. Not directed at anyone except Lenovo in particular. ;)

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