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T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 3:44 AM

I must have been living under a rock not having been aware of the T25... Am now lusting over it with my credit card itching, even having been using smaller X220/X260 laptops... I am definitely willing to grow in size to get that keyboard back!

 

Couple questions:

 

  • Is the HDMI port capable of 4K/60hz output in both Integrated Intel and Nvidia graphics mode? Or would that need to go thru the Thunderbolt port and an appropriate TB-> HDMI 2.0 adapter?
  • Is the M.2 slot in a x4/Gen.3 configuration? I have seen some benchmarks which mention a samsung SSD and about 1500MB/sec read/write, suggesting that it might not be a x4/Gen.3 M.2 slot?

Appreciate any insight!

 

Thanks

 

Solved! See the solution
---------------------
| X220 i7-2620M | 12.5" HD IPS | Intel 180GB SSD | Crucial 480GB mSATA SSD | 8GB DDR3 | Intel 7260 AC |
| X260 i7-6600U | 12.5" FHD IPS | Samsung 860Pro 512GB SSD | 16GB DDR4 | Intel 8260 AC |
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37 Posts

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 16:21 PM

Hi. I can answer your questions.

 

Purchased the T25 on the first day it was available here in Canada - Thursday October 5th.  Received it about a month later.

 

I wanted the "retro" keyboard in this laptop size, although the T25 does have a number of limitations which I am aware of and can live with.  I am using it primarily as my secondary work laptop.  Unfortunately, since most office locations only have a VGA connector to link to their overhead projectors, I had to purchase a VGA adapter since there is no VGA port on the T25.  Now, to answer your questions.

 

HDMI Port questions.  Well, I decided to copy/paste the info from the T25 user guide:

     "Your computer supports the following video resolution, if the external display also supports that resolution.

  • Up to 4096 x 2304 pixels / 60 Hz, with an external display connected to the USB-C connector.
  • Up to 4096 x 2160 pixels / 24 Hz, or 3840 x 2160 pixels / 30 Hz with an external display connected to the HDMI connector".

So, for 4K/60Hz output, using the Thunderbolt/USB-C port is the only way to go, using an HDMI adapter if your external display requires it.  Note another T25 limitation is that the NVIDIA GPU only outputs to external displays. It does not output to the laptop's display.  The T25 display can ONLY use the Integrated Intel graphics chip.

 

Ah, yes, the 2nd question.  Another T25 limitation.  Unfortunately, the T25 only supports 2 lanes, not 4 (so, it's a x2, not a x4).  My original thoughts were to swap out the 500GB M.2 SSD with a large Samsung 960 Pro, or with a large Samsung 960 EVO which has OPAL support, but discovered that since the T25 only supports 2 lanes, and not 4, I would be wasting my money.  So, I am keeping the 500GB SSD (which is actually a Lenovo M.2 OPAL SSD, not a Samsung one).  I am toying with the idea of using the M.2 WWAN slot to put in a small 2242 form factor M.2 SATA SSD to give me a bit more storage space (since this WWAN M.2 slot won't support NVMe SSDs).

 

Hope this insight helps you with your decision.

 

Cheers.

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8522 Posts

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 17:09 PM

wrote:

,,,

I am toying with the idea of using the M.2 WWAN slot to put in a small 2280 form factor M.2 SATA SSD to give me a bit more storage space (since this WWAN M.2 slot won't support NVMe SSDs).

...

I don't have a T25 :(   It shares some internals with the T470 which supports a SATA SSD in the WWAN slot.  Have you verified that the T25 does also? I haven't looked into it yet.

 

If it does, it certainly isn't 2280.  Probably 2242.

 

FWIW,

Z.


The large print: please read the Community Participation Rules before posting. Include as much information as possible: model, machine type, operating system, and a descriptive subject line. Do not include personal information: serial number, telephone number, email address, etc.


The fine print: I do not work for, nor do I speak for Lenovo. Unsolicited private messages will be ignored - questions and answers belong in the forum so that others may contribute and benefit. ... GeezBlog

 

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 17:22 PM

Good catch!.  Yes, I intended to type that the WWAN slot supports a 2242 form factor SSD, but there were some "transmission breakdowns" between brain and fingers.  I corrected this error in my original post.  Thanks!

 

I haven't purchased a 2242 form factor SATA SSD yet, so I cannot validate this on the T25.  My statement was based on what I learned about the T470, which the T25 is based on, and 2242 M.2 SATA SSDs have been validated to work in the T470's WWAN slot.  So, my unvalidated assumption is that it will work on the T25 too.  Thanks again for allowing me to clarify this.

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 17:37 PM

If and when you do try the WWAN slot SSD, please let us know how it goes.

 

There's a possibility of single-sided vs double-sided clearance issues.  No clue about that - and I've tended to ignore it with other laptops and gotten away with it.  So far.  Probably not a good idea.

 

Z.


The large print: please read the Community Participation Rules before posting. Include as much information as possible: model, machine type, operating system, and a descriptive subject line. Do not include personal information: serial number, telephone number, email address, etc.


The fine print: I do not work for, nor do I speak for Lenovo. Unsolicited private messages will be ignored - questions and answers belong in the forum so that others may contribute and benefit. ... GeezBlog

 

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574 Posts

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-29, 21:27 PM
Thanks for the info... I thought that 4k/60hz might need to go via Thunderbolt... That's no problem.

Too bad about the x2 M.2 slot, i guess about 1500MB/sec is still pretty good and 3x SATA what i have in my X260...

Also interesting part about the WWAN slot, might be able to get some more internal SATA M.2 storage in it...

I guess there probably won't be a refreshed 8th gen Coffee-Lake version of the T25 based on the upcoming T480, as it probably wouldn't be the Anniversary Edition anymore, so waiting for a new model is probably silly.

What to do, what to do... Spending $2500 CDN + tax on a machine with already 1+ year old hardware, but have the glorious keyboard...
---------------------
| X220 i7-2620M | 12.5" HD IPS | Intel 180GB SSD | Crucial 480GB mSATA SSD | 8GB DDR3 | Intel 7260 AC |
| X260 i7-6600U | 12.5" FHD IPS | Samsung 860Pro 512GB SSD | 16GB DDR4 | Intel 8260 AC |
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574 Posts

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-30, 16:40 PM

wrote:

So, for 4K/60Hz output, using the Thunderbolt/USB-C port is the only way to go, using an HDMI adapter if your external display requires it.  Note another T25 limitation is that the NVIDIA GPU only outputs to external displays. It does not output to the laptop's display.  The T25 display can ONLY use the Integrated Intel graphics chip.


I am just re-reading this, and not sure I understand... the NVIDIA GPU outputs only to external displays... I assume you mean when an external display is connected, such as a TV, that in that situation the GPU that drives the TV is Nvidia, and if you want to run in extended desktop mode, the laptop's display will be driven only by the Intel GPU?

 

Otherwise I would expect that the NVIDIA GPU can drive the laptop's display if there's nothing hooked up to any of the external ports. Otherwise if not, that would be quite pointless to have the GPU.

---------------------
| X220 i7-2620M | 12.5" HD IPS | Intel 180GB SSD | Crucial 480GB mSATA SSD | 8GB DDR3 | Intel 7260 AC |
| X260 i7-6600U | 12.5" FHD IPS | Samsung 860Pro 512GB SSD | 16GB DDR4 | Intel 8260 AC |
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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-31, 1:25 AM

Hi HiVolt,

 

Please read the item in this forum called "Reds are orange?" by harrisb, which talks about this GPU limitation.  I haven't found a way to resolve this issue of not being able to get the NVidia GPU to drive my laptop display either.  If someone else has solved this, please let us know how you did it.

 

Thanks.

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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-31, 2:05 AM

wrote:

Hi HiVolt,

 

Please read the item in this forum called "Reds are orange?" by harrisb, which talks about this GPU limitation.  I haven't found a way to resolve this issue of not being able to get the NVidia GPU to drive my laptop display either.  If someone else has solved this, please let us know how you did it.

 

Thanks.


Wow... Well that's certainly the deal breaker... Not sure what to say about that, but why on earth would they design it this way? Is it the same in the T470 with which the T25 appears to share some hardware design with?

 

I was thinking it over today and was leaning towards the purchase, but now, no way. I'm no hardcore gamer but I would have enjoyed trying a game on it when i was away from home, something I couldn't really do in my prior X220 and current X260 due to the Intel GPU only...

 

Too many minuses with this T25, to only one plus it seems, the keyboard, definitely not worth the almost $3k price in Canada after taxes, to have these limitations.

 

Maybe Lenovo will offer the classic 7 row keyboards on future X, T & W series. I'd pay a good premium for one, I'm sure many would as well, now that they've done the legwork and redesigned it for more modern chassis.

 

Oh well, too bad my short term excitement was short lived. Thanks for the help. I'll keep an eye on this forum just to see if anything develops...

---------------------
| X220 i7-2620M | 12.5" HD IPS | Intel 180GB SSD | Crucial 480GB mSATA SSD | 8GB DDR3 | Intel 7260 AC |
| X260 i7-6600U | 12.5" FHD IPS | Samsung 860Pro 512GB SSD | 16GB DDR4 | Intel 8260 AC |
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Re: T25 HDMI port 4K/60hz, M.2 x4/Gen.3?

2017-12-31, 14:55 PM

The T25 does not have the hardware to support anything but an M.2 SSD. The area that is used to support an HDD or 2.5" SSD does not have the connectors in place.

 

The restriction on the the use of the discrete GPU is the same as for the other T-series systems. If you want to use the discrete GPU for the internal display, you will need to go to the P-series systems which will allow that GPU to be set in the BIOS or via NVIDIA control. I too am hoping for a follow-on system that will use the 7-row keyboard! It was so nice having that again on the T25 that I received that I almost didn't want to send it back.


P53 XEON 2276 BIOS 1.25 OLED UHD 4K Multi-touch display, 96GB RAM, RTX5000, RAID 1, 1TB x 2 Samsung PM981, 1TB PM981, WWAN
P70 XEON 1505, BIOS 2.35, 4k Display, 64GB, M3000M NVIDIA GPU, RAID1 1TB Samsung PM981 PCIe-NVMe SSD x 2, 2x Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD. EM7455 WWAN
P1. BIOS 1.25,Xeon Processor, 4k UHD IPS multi-touch display, 32GB, PM981 1TB x 2, RAID1

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