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135 Posts

09-08-2009

Canada

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-13, 4:42 AM

If you look into the PDF just linked, it's i3-2310M, i5-2520M, i5-2540M, i7-2620M. While we can safely say the i3 is a poor choice (no turbo boost) , here are the others

 

  1. 2520M, 2.5/2.6/2.9 GHz, 650/1300 MHz GPU, $225
  2. 2540M, 2.6/3.1/3.3 GHz, 650/1300 MHz GPU, $266
  3. 2620M, 2.7/3.2/3.4 GHz, 650/1300 MHz GPU, $346

The difference between these are minute at best (and no, the 3MB vs 4MB of L3 cache does not matter much either) but the price difference is huge: 18% then 30% while the raw CPU MHz increase is about 4 and then 3 percent which translates to a big fat nothing in real world performance. In comparison, a fully boosted 2520M vs the i3 2310M has a 40% MHz difference which can translate into some real world performance.

 

On the other hand, the price difference between the 2540M and the 2520M is small enough for a $1500 laptop that it'd worth it as the boosted speeds are quite signifcantly faster. The i7, even considering the full laptop price doesn't.

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2 Posts

03-13-2011

California, USA

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-13, 7:20 AM

Will there be future mSATA SSD's that fit into the 3g internet card slot in the t420s in the future? Or does the intel 310s already do that?

That would be the ideal setup :) 80 gb ssd + 320 gb 7200 RPM data + optical drive!

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212 Posts

11-08-2010

BC, Canada

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-13, 8:44 AM
That's actually the plan (WWAN or SSD in that slot, take your pick), though the tabook doesn't exactly make this clear.

You can't do this with a Tx10- the special signal that SSD needs just isn't there- but you will be able to do it with a Tx20.

Apparently they're only offering the 80 GB version of the Intel 310 (that may or may not actually be the case in the long run), so I'd expect that option to cost , at the very least, 250 dollars (it would be more than 300 at current SSD option markup).

If you were to add it yourself after you bought it, that 80 GB part costs $190. Also, the 40GB SSD costs $100.

Unfortunately, the low speed of the 310 coupled with the fact that 300 dollars can buy an SSD that crushes it and has 128GB of space (and

Remember that an SSD can only give a good boost to only the applications that are installed on it. If you put every app on the SSD, you'd really see a boost, but if you just had it on the standard HDD, you'd see none.

Another strike against the mSATA option is a limitation of the QM67 chipset. It doesn't allow (not to my knowledge anyways) for caching- what that does is copies recently-read data to the SSD so everything goes faster.

It's a neat thing, though.
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135 Posts

09-08-2009

Canada

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-13, 9:38 AM

I found a Lenovo website http://www.lenovoquickpick.com/usa/system/thinkpad/t/t420s-140w-hd-hdplus and under hard disk it  says the part number 43N3424 is compatible with the T420s. Now... what's that? Well, I do not know. This website says ThinkStation 450GB 15K rpm SAS Hard Drive. The picture more resembles a 3.5" disk but googling clearly says 2.5" on tons of sites. But, as you know as well I do that the Savvio 15K maxes out at 146GB. And while it is possible someone else cooked a somewhat larger 15K drive say 300GB I will eat my hat if someone beats Seagate this badly :) and I checked Hitachi and WD too and have not found a trace of 15K 2.5" drives not to even mention a 450GB one.

 

Check http://shoplenovo.i2.com/SEUILibrary/controller/e/web/LenovoPortal/en_US/catalog.workflow:item.detail?GroupID=38&Code=43N3424&current-category-id=0179EC7B3B594E64B4B8C1A71065BF7B&&hide_menu_area=yes if you want to be even more confused. The drive is 14.7mm times 2.61mm times um four inches that'd be um 102.4 mm. That's one weird drive :D I suspect the first two is simply ten times more and this is a 3.5" disk and that database error is why the quickpick site cooked up this rather curious match. Still, I would love to know the truth :D did someone hide a SAS controller in the T420s? :smileysurprised:

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73 Posts

01-12-2011

United States of America

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-13, 16:50 PM

Yes, the Lenovo Quickpick thing is still a little strange at times - I saw the T420s battery on sale for a bargain price of $999.99 the other day, although it's been corrected now. Would be nice if there was a 450GB 15k SAS drive compatible with the T420s, but I suspect it may be too noisy, power hungry, large and SATA incompatible! ;-)

 

With regard to the i7 vs i5 discussion earlier in the thread, I found this useful article which compares them to one another. It's in German, but the Googlish translation isn't bad and the charts tell most of the story anyway:

 

Original article in German

Article in Googlish

 

Given the large price difference for the minimal performance difference, I think I'll be going for the i5-2540M myself.

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2 Posts

03-13-2011

California, USA

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-14, 0:22 AM

@Q-ball

I would install ubuntu (probably ~25gb) + win 7  (~55 gb) + all their apps on the ssd. That's what i have right now, but without SSD :(

 

might be a good idea to wait  for a fast sandforce msata to come out

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135 Posts

09-08-2009

Canada

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-14, 3:53 AM

Funny, people whining about the low speed of Intel 310. Yes there are faster drives but this is going to be fast as hell. Compare it to a 7200RPM HDD and consider :)

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7 Posts

09-15-2010

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-14, 21:35 PM

@chx @s1148625 @hecke @mitchsw @gdi2k

Single Thread and Multi Thread Performance Comparison of the Lenovo T410s, T420s and recent Sandy Bridge Processors

 

1. Introduction and Methods

     The single thread and multiple thread performance of several commercially available processors has been compared to the soon to be released Lenovo T420s.  Eight systems are considered: the Lenovo T410s, the Lenovo T420s, the entire line of recently released 13” and 15” MacBook Pros, and a high-performance desktop system used for comparison purposes (AlienWare Aurora-R3).

     For single thread performance the time to calculate pi to 32 million digits was used.  For multiple thread performance the time to complete wPrime 1024 was used.  Data was gathered from as many seemingly reliable sources as possible including notebookcheck, anandtech, and tomshardware.  Outliers were removed from the sample.  The author used his best judgment to get an accurate picture of the individual performances of the chips.  Most of the data points are based on more than 5 separate benchmarks, due to limitations of available data some data points may be based on as few as 2 or even 1 benchmark thus the results should be viewed as approximate but telling of general threads.   Results displayed in figures 1 and 2 are use the relative percentage difference equation (RPD) (see Wikipedia) to calculate the percentage difference in performance. 


2. Results and Discussion

2.1 Single Thread Performance

     As shown in figure 1 the single thread performance of the new Lenovo T420s is a dramatic improvement over the previous generation T410s (The Lenovo T410s is 22.5% slower).  The system also beats the both the 13 inch and 15 inch entry level MacBook Pros.

 Single Thread

     For single thread performance the mobile Sandy Bridge quad-core processors do not provide a significant improvement over the 2540M in the Lenovo T420s. Most applications are single thread dependent.  Having an expensive quad-core i7 will not provide much improvement in real world performance.  The performance of the 2620M is lower than expected, in reality it is probably faster than shown here.  The low value is probably due to experimental error with benchmarking process. 

Of note the older 2010 Intel Gulftown 980 Extreme Edition (not shown) gets single thread performance on par with the 2540M (it is 1% faster).  The T420s will be very fast indeed.


2.2 Multiple Thread Performance

     Multi-thread performance is shown in figure 2.  The entry level MacBook Pro 13 inch is significantly handicapped compared to rest due to its low 2.3GHz base speed and only 2 available cores.  The T420s and T410s essentially have the same multiple thread performance.  The Sandy Bridge quad-core offerings do give a large increase in multi-thread performance, with all higher end models (including the top-of-line desktop 2600K) seeing a boost of about 54% over the 2540M.

Multi Thread

     For multiple thread performance the mobile Sandy Bridge quad-core processors show a significant performance increase over the dual-core processors.  Having strong multi-threaded performance in a laptop would generally be less of priority as most day-to-applications do not make use of multi-threaded performance and the dual-cores already get good multiple-thread performance.  Heavy multi-threaded applications (very large simulations, computationally expensive models) are typically handed by desktops and servers anyway.  It is interesting that the 2.0GHz 15 inch MacBook Pro actually outperforms the 2.2GHz model in multi-threaded applications. 

     Of note, the older 2010 Intel Gulftown  980 Extreme Edition (not shown) would see a performance increase of more than 100% over the 2540M.  For heavy multithreaded tasks using the older Gulftown or even the older Xeons on desktops would see better multi-thread performance than Sandy Bridge offerings, at the cost of lost single thread performance compared to the 2600K. 

 


3. Conclusion

     Quad-core Sandy-Bridge processors provides almost no improvement in day-to-day performance gains over the i5-2540M processor equipped in the Lenovo T420s, as measured by the single thread performance.  Quad-core Sandy-Bridge processors do provide significant increases in multi-threaded performance but at significantly higher cost:

Cost of Sandy Bridge Processors

     The 2540M processor is a very good processor.  The more expensive alternatives do not provide any gain in single thread performance, while costing significantly more and likely producing more heat and using more energy. 

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52 Posts

01-30-2011

Germany

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-15, 13:25 PM
thanks @ cptcolo, that is a nice comparison. Did you perform it yourself? I still would have loved a quad-core in my T420s. Frequently i run more or less extensive simulations and the possibility to test several hypotheses at once is very nice. Since i got a quad desktop i much less compute on our cluster, but do a lot locally.

@all: Today is the mysterious date when the discrete graphics version of the T420s should be announced. Did anyone of you notice something in that direction?

best
hecke
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84 Posts

10-15-2008

Edmonton, Alberta, Canada

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Re: T420S? can't wait for it? when?!

2011-03-15, 19:35 PM

I thought it was going to get a nvidia 4200 in it?

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