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27 Posts

10-11-2020

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  • Message 1 of 22

closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-11, 5:17 AM

Hi,

 

I enabled S3  in the bios (linux mode in the power section), because the default win10 "modern standby" is a joke, the machine does not sleep, it keeps running in a "reduced" power mode.

 

But ran into the issue in the title. It does not matter whether "closing the lid" action is set to sleep or nothing. If you put it into s3 sleep via the os or power button or sleep shortcut, closing the lid will wake it. This pretty much makes it unusable as a portable device. I need real s3 sleep without the ridiculous waking on lid closing. Can this be fixed with the bios update?

 

Thanks

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27 Posts

10-11-2020

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  • Message 2 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-13, 16:51 PM

This problem has been confirmed on two machines. Why do lenovo representatives have nothing to say about it? It's beyond unreasonable for the closing of the lid to wake the machine. There needs to be a setting in the bios to ignore the lid sensor for sleep/wake purposes. There's already a setting to disable the lid sensor entirely but that's not an adequate solution as it keeps the display on after lid closing.

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1 Posts

10-13-2020

Germany

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  • Message 3 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-13, 18:03 PM

I'm also affected by this on Linux (NixOS). Interestingly, the system wakes up only on the edge of the 'lid closed' signal - ie, only when you just close the lid, but not if it's already closed.

 

That means you can work around the issue in software by slightly delaying the S3 sleep trigger after the 'lid closed' event has been detected by your operating system. This could be done by modifying whatever desktop manager or ACPI daemon you use.

 

You can also manually issue a "delay then sleep" command, then close your lid. For instance, `sleep 10; systemctl suspend`, then closing your lid. Naturally, you should integrate this with whatever screen locker you use if your doesn't automatically engage after a `systemctl suspend`.

 

Naturally, these are workarounds to what seems to be an embedded controller / ACPI bug, and I'd like to see this be addressed by Lenovo.

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27 Posts

10-11-2020

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  • Message 4 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-13, 20:20 PM

The bottom line here is that with S3, they support adequately only the default sleep/wake mechanism, closing and opening the lid.

 

They seem to have forgotten that that's just one option. Sleep can be initiated also by the power button, sleep shortcut, the OS. For those other modes, the user needs to be able to specify what wakes the machine.

 

  • it should obviously never be the closing of the lid
    • no bios setting needed, if it's already asleep it never makes sense to wake on closing
  • I want only the power button or sleep shortcut to wake, to avoid accidental waking. This is a portable device with a very limited battery life, it's essential to be able to reliably S3 it. What Microsoft is trying to pull with their "modern standby"  is insane. They want you to have a portable that can't sleep. 
  • so optionally opening the lid should not wake
    • bios setting needed
  • optionally the keyboard should not wake
    • I already looked into this, win10 does not appear to be at fault here
    • "powercfg -devicequery wake_armed" does not show the keyboard as a wake trigger
    • so it's the bios that decides to wake on keyboard
    • therefore the bios needs a setting for it
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27 Posts

10-11-2020

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  • Message 5 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-16, 15:51 PM

Tech-support is useless for for this. They can't do anything themselves, obviously, but their escalation process is not encouraging. Their second tier support just promised to escalate to management who then should inform lenovo, but couldn't promise any feedback to my case. Basically: wait indefinitely for something that may not happen, and if it never makes it to lenovo engineering, you won't even know.

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6825 Posts

10-29-2009

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  • Message 6 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-25, 16:20 PM

I could reproduce this issue.  I will report this to BIOS team and try to get a fix.

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  • Message 7 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-25, 17:13 PM

@someotherguy Thank you. I just want to underscore a few points I'm hoping you could pass along.

 

  • For the closing of the lid, no additional bios settings are needed, it should never be used as a wake signal.
  • But it's reasonable to be able to configure what wakes the machine.
  • In my case I want it to be very explicit, power and sleep buttons only, to avoid accidental wakes.
  • That means excluding lid opening and the keyboard.
  • Those two cannot be configures via the os, "powercfg -devicequery wake_armed" does not include them.
  • So bios settings are needed "allow lid open to wake", "allow keyboard to wake"
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6825 Posts

10-29-2009

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  • Message 8 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-25, 17:44 PM

We won't be adding any BIOS settings, but if this bug can be fixed, then it should be possible to disable lid-close actions in Windows such that opening or closing lid has no effect.  Then it would behave just like any other thinkPad from last 10 years.

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27 Posts

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  • Message 9 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-25, 18:00 PM

@someotherguy 

 

then it should be possible to disable lid-close actions in Windows such that opening or closing lid has no effect

 

That's fine, but what about the keyboard? I don't insist on bios settings per se, and would be happy to use the os to exclude the keyboard, but it's already excluded ("powercfg -devicequery wake_armed" does not show it) and the keyboard in the device manager does not have the "power management" tab" with "allow this device to wake the computer" setting.

 

If you don't want to add a bios setting for the keyboard, can you allow the os to control it?

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6825 Posts

10-29-2009

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  • Message 10 of 22

Re:closing the lid of a sleeping (S3 standby) T14 AMD, wakes it

2020-10-25, 22:52 PM

I see what you're saying.  On previous ThinkPad model, only Fn key will cause a wake from S3 (other keys will not wake).  On T14 AMD, in "linux" sleep mode, any key will wake up from S3 - it is still behaving like Modern Standby even though Modern Standby is disabled by BIOS setting.  I'll see if this is something that can be fixed along with the lid close, though I'm less hopeful about this keyboard situation.

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