Welcome to our peer-to-peer forums, where owners help owners. Need help now? Visit eSupport here.

English Community

ThinkPad NotebooksThinkPad: X Series Laptops
All Forum Topics
Options

3 Posts

06-05-2021

Hong Kong S.A.R of China

3 Signins

20 Page Views

  • Posts: 3
  • Registered: ‎06-05-2021
  • Location: Hong Kong S.A.R of China
  • Views: 20
  • Message 1 of 7

X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-05, 4:14 AM

Problem:

Youtube video shows color segmenting/banding on smooth color transistions.

https://youtu.be/05przYOpp28

 

Platform:

Lenovo X1 Yoga i7-1165G7 Xe graphics and 3840x2400 HDR display.

Windows 10 20H2 Build 19042.985

Graphics driver using 27.20.100.9510, 27.20.100.9466, 27.20.100.9616. Same result.

 

Setting:

Windows HDR ON.

Windows scaling set to 225%.

AC power is plugged in.

 

Observation:

1. In full screen mode, when scaling is 225%, the color segmenting/banding is observed. (Image  #1). Similar for 175%, 350%.

 

2.  However, if scaling is 250%, there is no issue. (Image #2). Similar for 100%, 125%, 150%, 200%, 300%, 400%.

 

3. In window mode, regardless of scaling factor, the issue is observed when video frame is resized to some dimension (image #3). 

 

On the other hand, there is no issue on some other  dimensions (image #4). Multiple dimensions is observed to have color segmenting/banding issue.

 

4. Further, putting Intel Command Center on top of the video frame "fix" the color segmenting/banding issue. (Image #5).

 

5. Printscreen image shows no issue when color segmenting/banding is observed. It means that color code in graphics memory is correct.

 

6. Switch OFF windows HDR "fix" the issue.

 

7. On the other hand, on desktop with GTX1060 has no issue regardless of full screen/window mode.

 

8. Color segmenting/banding issue is observed in full screen mode regardless of scaling when running in battery mode.

 

9.  During testing with external monitor, I hook up another two monitor in one attempt. The problem is "fixed" under the three monitor configuration.

i.e. Internal 3840x2400 10bit HDR 60fps + Thunderbolt USB-C DP LG27UP850-W 3840x2160 10bit HDR 60fps + HDMI AOC 1920x1080 8bit SDR 60fps. The white cable is Thunderbolt USB-C and the black cable is HDMI. (Image #9). All three monitor has to be switched on for this to work.

It is verified that both external Thunderbolt DP USB-C monitor and internal monitor runs in HDR mode by comparing youtube HDR video played on the external DP monitors and internal monitor vs HDMI SDR monitor.

 

If only the Thunderbolt USB-C DP monitor is attached, the behaviour is the same as before. Color segmenting/banding is observed. (Image #10)

 

If  only the HDMI monitor is attached, same color segmenting/banding problem is observed . White USB-C DP cable is removed and replaced by DC power plug-in. (Image #11)

 

Thank you for your attention. Looking forward to a solving the issue.

 

Reply
Options

2074 Posts

01-08-2021

Philippines

142 Signins

10535 Page Views

  • Posts: 2074
  • Registered: ‎01-08-2021
  • Location: Philippines
  • Views: 10535
  • Message 2 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-05, 7:21 AM

Hello carson945,

 


Welcome to Lenovo Community

 

 

Have you updated the BIOS to the latest version (thru the support site), if not please do so and follow the README txt file for guidance.

Try fully uninstalling the display driver, completely remove it from the system then download and install a fresh copy of the driver from the same support website (that would be version 27.20.100.9510)

Have you tried playing the video thru YouTube app instead running it thru the web?
Update us how it goes

 

 

Regards, 
Lorenzo_Lenovo



Did someone help you today? Press the star on the left to thank them with a Kudo!
If you find a post helpful and it answers your question, please mark it as an "Accepted Solution"! This will help the rest of the Community with similar issues identify the verified solution and benefit from it.

Follow us @LenovoSupport on Facebook and Twitter!

Reply
Options

3 Posts

06-05-2021

Hong Kong S.A.R of China

3 Signins

20 Page Views

  • Posts: 3
  • Registered: ‎06-05-2021
  • Location: Hong Kong S.A.R of China
  • Views: 20
  • Message 3 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-05, 11:43 AM

Hello Lorenzo_Lenovo, 

 

Thanks for your suggestion. 

 

I've just updated the BIOS to the lastest version 1.39 and re-install 9510 display driver after un-install and removal display driver files.

The behaviour is still the same. Problem not solved.

 

Consider the fact that

1. GTX1060 + 4K HDR monitor has no issue. It means that youtube on Chrome should not have issue.

2. Indeed, printscreen image is correct. It means that video decoding is correct.

3. Battery mode always show the issue. It means that it is not application software issue.

4. Putting Intel Command Center on Top of video frame "fix" the problem. Besides, three monitor configuration is correct while standalone internal monitor or internal monitor + single external monitor is incorrect. 

 

It means that problem is associated with some kind of hardware / driver bug of Intel Xe graphics or X1 Yoga Gen6.

 

To all folks with Intel Xe, do you have similar findings as mine?

 

Reply
Options

90 Posts

08-15-2017

Netherlands

106 Signins

1271 Page Views

  • Posts: 90
  • Registered: ‎08-15-2017
  • Location: Netherlands
  • Views: 1271
  • Message 4 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-07, 8:59 AM

X1Y3 here. Different but same :) This problem is bugging me from the start.

Except I always have that bandig (regardless of all your different proposals which I tested). Never found an expanation (mpc-hc/youtube/vimeo). This is puzzeling me also.

 

Could you try a tool called "ditherig" which disables Intel graphic cards dithering?:

 

https://kawamoto.no-ip.org/henteko/myapp_en.html

 

https://kawamoto.no-ip.org/henteko/myapp/ditherig114.zip

 

You can also read about it (eye strain)

 

https://community.intel.com/t5/Graphics/Dithering-on-iGPUs/td-p/248658

 

I you need any help with that I can assist. You basically have to call ditherig.exe after unpacking and select no dithering.

 

It didn't work for me unfortunately. But who knows?

 

-

 

First I was assuming that it's my panel but specs say it's a true 8bit panel (not 6bit +frc). I then went down further the rabbid whole.

 

There's an option in Bios (that is if you have unlocked the Advanced Settings via a bios mod) that's called "Panel bit depth" and that can have a value of 18bit or 24bit =8x8x8 = 16M colors = no banding). I'm just on the way of testing that...

 

-

 

On the other hand your findings show it's clearly driver related as you can modify the behaviour by dragging the control panel over it or changing scaling. That leaves me to the conclusion Intel f*cked up their HDR or PAPV chain resulting in a "reduced" bit depth. Nice findings btw!

 

I also found this:

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000057132/graphics.html

 

Intel® Graphics supports up to 12-bit color depth, but this may vary depending on the display. On our current driver implementation, the color depth will be set per the OS configuration.

 

and

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000057279/graphics/graphics-for-8th-generation-intel-processors.html

 

Seems that Intel is switching back and forth from 6bit to 8bit. Maybe that HDR or "video protection chain" sh*t is the culprit and it's clearly the driver not giving us any control over bit depth.

 

Keep me updated.

 

Edit: Did you look for the powersettings in the Intel control panel and disabled all energy options (as you experienced different outcomes on battery)?

 

Reply
Options

10855 Posts

09-04-2014

Slovakia

32908 Signins

1225070 Page Views

  • Posts: 10855
  • Registered: ‎09-04-2014
  • Location: Slovakia
  • Views: 1225070
  • Message 5 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-11, 10:37 AM

Hello @carson945 

 

Thanks for posting about this. I passed your post on to engineering to ask their thoughts, according to them what you are seeing is a known limitation of processing SDR content in HDR mode, other similarly equipped systems will display the same symptoms. The below picture was captured on a different system, the content is SDR and 8 bit, it exhibits the same symptoms you have described.

 

HDR mode encodes HDR content in 10bit but SDR encodes content in 8bit with dithering.

10bit HDR content decoded in 10bit resolution has no problem regardless dithering function.

But 8bit SDR content decoded in 10bit resolution shows such banding if dithering is turned off.

Dithering malfunction in HDR mode is the root cause and maybe very common in all windows PC.

 

Andy

 

English Community Administrator
Lenovo eServices

Please remember to come back and mark the post that you feel solved your question as the solution, it earns the member + points 
Did you find a post helpfull? You can thank the member by awarding them a Thumbs Up
 

Please don't ask me questions by Personal Message; questions belong in the forums.


Using Browser Search to find your answers in Lenovo and Moto Community
Reply
Options

3 Posts

06-05-2021

Hong Kong S.A.R of China

3 Signins

20 Page Views

  • Posts: 3
  • Registered: ‎06-05-2021
  • Location: Hong Kong S.A.R of China
  • Views: 20
  • Message 6 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-11, 12:39 PM

Hello Andy, 

 

Thanks for responding and asking for technical support. It is good to know that I'm not alone.

 

As first I also thought that SDR content on HDR display will be like this.

However, I got a HDR monitor recently and hook up with my PC with GTX1060. They also run in 10bit. There is no issue at all. This make me raise the issue.

 

Indeed, "SDR on HDR" does not explain for

a. PC GTX1060+HDR monitor has no issue.

b. resizing the video frame size "fix" the problem

c. setting different windows scaling % "fix" the problem

d. putting Intel Command Center on top of the video frame "fix" the problem

e. Battery mode always has problem. Cannot be "fixed" using scaling. It means that the behaviour is different between plugged in and battery mode.

f. Plug in two external monitor (DP + HDMI) + internal monitor "fix" the problem

 

This make me raise the questions.

1. Is this a problem with X1 Yoga?

2. Is this a problem with Intel Iris Xe inside X1 Yoga?

 

May I know the graphics system that you take the picture? Is it also Intel Iris Xe? Is it also a Lenovo machine?

 

It will be grateful if Lenovo engineering can step in and repeat my experiment so as to isolate the problem and eventually find out the bug.

Characteristics (d) (e) (f) points to some kind of state switching are associated with problem.

 

Regards,

carson945

 

 

Reply
Options

90 Posts

08-15-2017

Netherlands

106 Signins

1271 Page Views

  • Posts: 90
  • Registered: ‎08-15-2017
  • Location: Netherlands
  • Views: 1271
  • Message 7 of 7

Re:X1 Yoga Gen6 show color segment/banding on youtube video when windows HDR is ON

2021-06-12, 13:39 PM

@Andy_Lenovo 

 

Thanks for looking into this. But your explanation (= the engineers explanation) is incorrect given all the details above.

 

On X1Y3 I see banding regardeless of the HDR mode windows is in.

 

This goes much deeper.

 

Could be (at least on my X1Y3):

 

Bios:

Panel Color Depth

One Of Option: 18 Bit, Value (8 bit): 0x0 (default) {09 07 E2 12 30 00 00}

One Of Option: 24 Bit, Value (8 bit): 0x1 18 Bit, Value (8 bit)

 

Intel Display driver issue (most likely see above)

Intel PAPV chain issue (= driver issue see above)

 

or somethinge else prohibiting the full RGB range and forcing dithering instead.

 

Would appreciate if you could have them look a little deeper and keep us updated.

Reply
Forum Home

Community Guidelines

Please review our Guidelines before posting.

Learn More

Check out current deals!

Go Shop
X

Save

X

Delete

X

No, I don’t want to share ideas Yes, I agree to these terms