cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Reply
swhitcher
Serial Port
Posts: 59
Registered: ‎02-15-2010
Location: US
Views: 6,212
Message 1 of 13

x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

We've purchased about 2 dozen 4th gen x1 carbons, machine type 20fb, and have been having some intermittent keyboard issues with multiple laptops.  At least 3 different units have had problems where the keyboard doesn't seem to work at all.  After power on, we press F12, F1, or Enter to try and access different functions, but they have no effect.  Once windows loads, we still can't type anything.  

 

The first time my tech ran into this, he rebooted a few times and was still experiencing the same issue, he set the laptop aside for me to look at.  When I turned it on, they keyboard was functioning normally.  Later, after loading our image on the computer, he was preparing to deploy it to a user when the keyboard stopped working again.

 

I fired up a new laptop this morning, fresh out of the box, and had the same issue, a non-functional keyboard.  In this case at least, the touchpoint/touchpad didn't work either.  I rebooted, tried to get into UEFI config, and after a couple of more reboots I tried pxe booting, but nothing I pressed on the keyboard seemed to help.  I turned the laptop off and put a note on it that it had a bad keyboard, but when my tech came in and turned it on a couple of hours later, they keyboard is working fine.  

 

I've got one in front of me right now that was working this morning, but now the touchpad/point aren't responding.  Keyboard is working though. 

 

Lastly, we issued one of this model to a user recently, and she has intermittently had the keyboard stop responding while she's in the middle of working on a document.  After a few minutes, it might start working again. 

 

These issues may or may not be related to each other, but it's very odd behavior and we haven't quite been able to pin down the cause.  Anyone else seen something of this sort?

 

Any suggestions?

Willi_Cheng
Paper Tape
Posts: 3
Registered: ‎07-20-2016
Location: HK
Views: 6,140
Message 2 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Hello all,

 

We've got the same problem here with our x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB). Lucky, we just purchased 2 but not 2 dozen. Smiley Happy

Both of them have the same problem which same as Swhitcher.

 

We've called the Lenovo support hotline and ask for the onsite support. The on-site engineer replaced the mother board for us, but after 1 hour, problem occur again.

 

We're going to deploy those computers to the end user very soon.

So please, give us the solution as soon as you can, Lenovo!

Many Thanks!

 

Willi

Former Employee
Posts: 1,664
Registered: ‎09-16-2014
Location: US
Views: 6,103
Message 3 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

I would like to find out if these X1 Carbon 4th Gen systems are experiencing the failure when a single system is sitting flat on a desk, or if the systems have been stacked and the failure occurs on the system on top of the stack?

 

Lenovo has previously worked with customers deploying large numbers of ThinkPad systems where stacking systems causes the keyboard, trackpoint, touchpad, and touch panel to stop functioning. What has been observed is that the proximity of one system to another triggers the magnet of the LCD Open position sensor (also known as the LID Switch) on the system in use. This causes the Embedded Controller to disable the keyboard, trackpoint, touchpad, and touch panel function, turning off all physical input to the system in use.

 

Any additional information you could provide about how the system is being used would be appreciated because if the systems are not being stacked, an investigation will be needed.

 

Thank you,

swhitcher
Serial Port
Posts: 59
Registered: ‎02-15-2010
Location: US
Views: 6,099
Message 4 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

That is a very good question. I don't recall off the top of my head whether there might have been one or more laptops under the one that I was working on at the time. I am out of the office until Tuesday, but I will try to pay attention to this next time it comes up. 

 

I know that in one case an end user reported the keyboard not responding intermittently, and that would have been a single laptop on a desk, but I don't know if that was exactly the same issue. 

Former Employee
Posts: 1,664
Registered: ‎09-16-2014
Location: US
Views: 6,095
Message 5 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Switcher,

The single user reporting intermittent function may be an unrelated failure. If the system is running the latest BIOS, v1.15 released 7/4, and Synaptics UltraNav Driver v19.0.17.98 released 6/4 has been deleted and reinstalled then the system may require service.

These can be downloaded here: http://support.lenovo.com/us/en/products/Laptops-and-netbooks/ThinkPad-X-Series-laptops/ThinkPad-X1-...

Thank you,
Willi_Cheng
Paper Tape
Posts: 3
Registered: ‎07-20-2016
Location: HK
Views: 6,056
Message 6 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Dear Amy,

 

Thanks for your quick response.

For your information, those systems haven't been stacked when the problem occurred.

Also, we have applied the latest BIOS and Synaptics UltraNav Driver you mentioned.

 

May be, would you mind to tell us how to disable the "LID Switch" or how to make the "Embedded Controller" to ignore the fault signal from the "LID Switch" as a workaround?

 

I agree that something trigger the problem with our observation but it may not just happen when systems have been stacked.

I suggest to escalate to the development team for further investigation

 

Thanks for your kindly help and follow up! Waiting for your good news.

 

Willi Cheng

Former Employee
Posts: 1,664
Registered: ‎09-16-2014
Location: US
Views: 5,997
Message 7 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Think Engineering reports that due to the design, there is no way to disable the LID Switch and no work around exists to make the EC ignore the fault signal from the LID Switch.

 

I encourage customers experiencing disabled keyboards, touchpads, and keyboards upon boot up on systems that have not been stacked to contact Lenovo for direct support. This will allow Lenovo to investigate the specifics of each situation. If an issue is identified, Lenovo will then work to provide a solution to customers.

 

Thank you,

swhitcher
Serial Port
Posts: 59
Registered: ‎02-15-2010
Location: US
Views: 5,985
Message 8 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Amy -- I've had a chance now to discuss this issue with our tech, and he is reasonably sure that the stacked laptop issue is exactly what we've been running into.  He was even able to reproduce the problem this morning based on the information you provided.  Thank you for the quick and accurate response!

 

Regarding the other issue, related to a BIOS update and Synaptics driver, can you expand on that a bit?   If the synaptics driver is removed and reinstalled on a laptop running the current bios, what happens that would cause the laptop to require service?  Would this occur only if the driver was removed and re-installed using the setup program, as opposed to installing the driver again after re-imaging the laptop? 

 

Thanks,

Steve

Former Employee
Posts: 1,664
Registered: ‎09-16-2014
Location: US
Views: 5,977
Message 9 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Steve,

 

I am glad to hear you were able to determine that your issue was caused by stacking. 

 

As for the single user experiencing loss of keyboard function during use, this problem could have a number of root causes. It could be a software bug, a faulty keyboard, a faulty keyboard cable, a keyboard cable that is not seated properly, or some other manufacturing issue.

 

I recommended upgrading the BIOS and Synaptics driver prior to sending it as sometimes this will resolve an issue that is a software bug, and is usually the first step when troubleshooting a keyboard input issue and will be the first step a depot takes when they receive the system.

 

If however your systems are running a standard enterprise image tailored to a specific set of users, then the problem is unlikely to be a software bug. My next recommendation would be to review the Hardware Maintance Manual and open the system to check the keyboard cable connection. The HMM for X1 Carbon 4th Gen can be found here:

https://download.lenovo.com/pccbbs/mobiles_pdf/x1carbon_mt20fb-20fc_x1yoga_hmm_en_sp40j72016.pdf

 

If you are uncomfortable opening the system (which does not void warranty), or find that reseating the keyboard cable does not resolve the issue, the next step will likely be to contact Lenovo Service for assistance.

 

Thank you,

Willi_Cheng
Paper Tape
Posts: 3
Registered: ‎07-20-2016
Location: HK
Views: 5,960
Message 10 of 13

Re: x1 Carbon 4th gen (20FB) intermittent keyboard issues

Hello Amy,

Thanks for the information and we've already discuss with the Lenovo Local Support in Hong Kong, they agree to collect the laptop and send back to their repair center for further checking and investigation.
Again, Thanks for your follow up.

Willi
Top Kudoed Authors