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613 Posts

07-20-2009

US

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  • Message 11 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 3:30 AM

Super upsetting. Just go a little easy on the claims of fraud (honestly I'm pretty sure overcharging people for non-existent warranty service is NOT their evil 'get rich quick' scheme) because that kind of thing gets threads closed etc.

 

If they promised on-site repair they are obviously going to have to arrange some kind of fix in this case, I just hope they do that ASAP as opposed to having this thread drag on and having the negativity spread. And if this is really the way it's going to be (and I pray to McFry that it isn't - wink to TPCR thread), boy do they need to change the ordering page quickly.. 

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51 Posts

05-19-2013

UK

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  • Message 12 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 15:34 PM

It isn't fraud, but may be breach of contract.

 

I say "may" because the terms and conditions that came with my extended warranty state: "Some repairs may need to be completed at a service center. If so, the service provider will send the product to the service center at its expense and return the repaired or replacement product to you at its expense."

 

I do wonder if the limited availability of the Helix at the moment also means that they can't get hold of spare parts quick enough to offer onsite maintenance at the moment.

 

It is a prime example of how not to manage customer relations - "we are not honouring the on-site warranty" is pretty much a declaration of breach of contract and almost certainly upset the customer; "unfortunately due to limite availability of parts at the moment, we will need to complete the repair at a service centre in this instance" (assuming that this is the reason) may have diffused the situation at little!

 

Anyway, if there *is* anyone from Lenovo reading this, could I suggest that you get a PR person to respond pretty quickly either confirming that this is a temporary situation either due to parts or that the engineers haven't had the training required to handle the Helix yet, or if this is a permanent situation offering refunds to anyone who may have been missold an on site warranty. It isn't necessarily the mistake which damages a reputation as how you handle the mistake!

 

Matthew

 

 

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26 Posts

04-29-2013

Minnesota, USA

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  • Message 13 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 15:51 PM

"...took my money for a warranty that is not compatible with the Helix" is a curious phrase.  

 

So is it some generic warranty, or the wrong  Thinkpad warranty or the one specifically for the Helix (which btw: still on the Lenovo sales website)?  If you bought the Helix warranty that's still on the website, they would honor that, right?  I mean, it really is consumer fraud not to, and really bad business.  

 

As a lawyer, I can tell you that shady little companies and con men will do that stuff to make a quick buck and disappear, but it's pretty rare for a big established company to sell a warranty they don't intend to honor (especially on a new product).  It makes Attorneys General (mostly elected officials) salivate for a nice big press conference.

 

And a refund on the warranty is inadequate.  Your remedy is either 'specific performance' (onsite service warranty) or a refund on the whole shebang.

 

OTH, if you somehow were sold a wrong warranty, then your beef may be with the reseller, who sounds a little shady.  Please name  this reseller that won't accept a 19 day old return when they sold you the wrong warranty.  I strongly suspect that's your target.

 

Just please, please tell me you didn't go on Ebay or similar and buy the Helix and a separate warranty on the cheap.  If someone did that (or similar) and then came here and pooped all over Lenovo's reputation, that might be actionable as well.  I'm sure you didn't do that, right?

 

(I was slower than the mdovey, who makes several good points.  However, in this country, advertising to sell and selling a service with no intent to honor the plain language of the promise is consumer fraud.  And yes, we could probably forgive a temporary parts shortage, but that's not what they're telling him.)

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194 Posts

06-21-2012

US

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  • Message 14 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 21:25 PM

wrote:

"...took my money for a warranty that is not compatible with the Helix" is a curious phrase.  

 

So is it some generic warranty, or the wrong  Thinkpad warranty or the one specifically for the Helix (which btw: still on the Lenovo sales website)?  If you bought the Helix warranty that's still on the website, they would honor that, right?  I mean, it really is consumer fraud not to, and really bad business.  

 

As a lawyer, I can tell you that shady little companies and con men will do that stuff to make a quick buck and disappear, but it's pretty rare for a big established company to sell a warranty they don't intend to honor (especially on a new product).  It makes Attorneys General (mostly elected officials) salivate for a nice big press conference.

 

And a refund on the warranty is inadequate.  Your remedy is either 'specific performance' (onsite service warranty) or a refund on the whole shebang.

 

OTH, if you somehow were sold a wrong warranty, then your beef may be with the reseller, who sounds a little shady.  Please name  this reseller that won't accept a 19 day old return when they sold you the wrong warranty.  I strongly suspect that's your target.

 

Just please, please tell me you didn't go on Ebay or similar and buy the Helix and a separate warranty on the cheap.  If someone did that (or similar) and then came here and pooped all over Lenovo's reputation, that might be actionable as well.  I'm sure you didn't do that, right?

 

(I was slower than the mdovey, who makes several good points.  However, in this country, advertising to sell and selling a service with no intent to honor the plain language of the promise is consumer fraud.  And yes, we could probably forgive a temporary parts shortage, but that's not what they're telling him.)


Resellers like Newegg would sell a laptop with a 3 year warranty so it could have come with the model he bought.

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49 Posts

01-06-2013

Nebraska

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  • Message 15 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 21:45 PM

All good points. I was actually told by a Lenovo representative today that "fraud" is the correct word for selling a warranty they won't honor. Realistically, they just weren't thinking about it and had not anticipated needing to change the warranty description as it pertained to the Helix. As of my last conversation from a Lenovo representative, "the on-site warranty will only apply to the tablet portion of the Helix. The keyboard dock or ADP claims will require depot service only." The problem seems to be that Lenovo did not create a separate SKU or part number for the keyboard dock. This, in essence, makes every Helix one part number, incapable of shipping separate parts. I am waiting for a 100% confirmation on this. I can probably live with that scenario as the main pc components are located in the tablet. Lenovo is very disturbed about the fact that many of their tech support people in Atlanta don't even know what the Helix is, so that will be dealt with immediately. As for my situation, they are shipping me a brand new unit, even though I only need a keyboard dock, because they don't have any way in their service system to handle just the repair of the dock right now. I was not going to accept a replacement without the extended warranty confirmation, but I am fairly confident that they will honor that statement and I have an email as proof.

 

As for my original purchase. I got it from an authorized Lenovo reseller. Their return period is only 14 days, so that is why they would not honor the return or replacement. I purchased the 3yr Next business day on-site ADP, priority technical support warranty directly from Lenovo, so no cut rate purchases off of eBay. I have been in IT for over 20 years and don't purchase anything off of eBay. After all of the problems with the TP2 I feel pretty confident after my last conversation with Lenovo that they are interested in fixing this issue quickly. As to how they will treat everyone else that purchased a warranty or has a defect in the keyboard dock, I can't say. I understand that Lenovo is not purposefully trying to defraud any customers with the warranty, but that was the only word that came to mind and was echoed by the Lenovo rep who had purchased a Helix also with a warranty and were very disturbed about what tech support managers and warranty services were telling me.

 

I will not consider this issue resolved until I receive the new system, return my old one and get a firm, professionally written response about how the Lenovo extended warranties will work with the Helix. I will continue to update my experience in the coming weeks, but for now I am finally feeling better about Lenovo service after speaking with my current agent. She is a higher up in Customer Care Enterprise Retentions. Good luck to everyone else!

 

 

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51 Posts

05-19-2013

UK

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  • Message 16 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 22:13 PM

Right,

 

So for onsite repairs the keyboard is regarded as a seperate peripheral to the Helix so isn;t covered, but for depot repairs the keyboard is regarded as an integral part of the Helix!

 

I think Lenovo should allocate an SKU for the keyboard, not only to resolve this issue but because I can see circumstances where someone may wish to purchase a replacement or spare keyboard.

 

Matthew

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194 Posts

06-21-2012

US

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  • Message 17 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 22:25 PM

wrote:

Right,

 

So for onsite repairs the keyboard is regarded as a seperate peripheral to the Helix so isn;t covered, but for depot repairs the keyboard is regarded as an integral part of the Helix!

 

I think Lenovo should allocate an SKU for the keyboard, not only to resolve this issue but because I can see circumstances where someone may wish to purchase a replacement or spare keyboard.

 

Matthew


I would think the people working at Lenovo know what they are doing. After all , they are making lots of money.

 

If something caused them to lose money , they'll want to fix it as soon as possible.

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51 Posts

05-19-2013

UK

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  • Message 18 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 22:35 PM

Making lots of money, does not mean you don't make mistakes.

 

So far Lenovo 

 

i) have support engineers saying they'v never heard of the Helix

ii) yesterday said they would not honour the on site warranty they were selling for the Helix at all (tantamount to breach of contract if not fraud)

iii) are today saying that the keyboard is not an integral part of the Helix so not covered by the on site warranty, but is an integral part of the Helix so can't be replaced seperately

 

Yep, sounds like they know what they are doing...

 

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194 Posts

06-21-2012

US

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  • Message 19 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 23:06 PM

wrote:

Making lots of money, does not mean you don't make mistakes.

 

So far Lenovo 

 

i) have support engineers saying they'v never heard of the Helix

ii) yesterday said they would not honour the on site warranty they were selling for the Helix at all (tantamount to breach of contract if not fraud)

iii) are today saying that the keyboard is not an integral part of the Helix so not covered by the on site warranty, but is an integral part of the Helix so can't be replaced seperately

 

Yep, sounds like they know what they are doing...

 


I used to have that same viewpoint but Lenovo proved me wrong.

 

They showed me that they don't need to fix things like that to make most of their  customers happy.

 

Only a small percentage of us care.

 

I could go on and on how the ThinkPad brand is dead but that's never going to solve anything.

 

Why do you think I've stopped buying ThinkPads?

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226 Posts

10-08-2012

md, us

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  • Message 20 of 43

Re: Lenovo is not honoring Helix on-site warranty!

2013-05-30, 23:39 PM

wrote:

wrote:

Making lots of money, does not mean you don't make mistakes.

 

So far Lenovo 

 

i) have support engineers saying they'v never heard of the Helix

ii) yesterday said they would not honour the on site warranty they were selling for the Helix at all (tantamount to breach of contract if not fraud)

iii) are today saying that the keyboard is not an integral part of the Helix so not covered by the on site warranty, but is an integral part of the Helix so can't be replaced seperately

 

Yep, sounds like they know what they are doing...

 


I used to have that same viewpoint but Lenovo proved me wrong.

 

They showed me that they don't need to fix things like that to make most of their  customers happy.

 

Only a small percentage of us care.

 

I could go on and on how the ThinkPad brand is dead but that's never going to solve anything.

 

Why do you think I've stopped buying ThinkPads?


you are entitled to your own opinion and decision. but why should other poeple care? I have been happy with my thinkpads so far  but I don't expect everyone will be happy.

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