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Lause
Punch Card
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎01-27-2009
Location: Denmark
Views: 1,700
Message 1 of 15

Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

The machine is a Lenovo Thinkpad Helix 3XXX (type 36986CG), a hybrid with detachable keyboarddock. An year and a half or two years old. Updated from 8.1 to 10 via Windows update a month ago.

 

I'm experiencing lags and holds, when primarily, opening at website with Flash or other things going on, like video or a chat window. The cursor reacts with seconds delay, hardly to control, have to use my fingers to close the browser again on the touch screen. And it's the same, regardless using Firefox, Chrome (this is worst), Edge or IE. Very annoying!

Closing the window or tab with the problematic page, the computer responds quickly as i would expect it to...

Tried to disable the native flash-player in Chrome, didn't help. Went from Chrome Canary back to regular Chrome, didn't help.

Also I had CPU or GPU (onboard) suspected, but installed all relevant Intel management software, got Lenovo System Update and got system specific software and drivers, but left out the bloatware.

I can vaguely remember same problems, when I went from W 8 to 8.1, but can't remember the problem and the solution. I think, I did a reset, but not sure.

 

Here's a more accurate explanation:


The whole thing started when I updated Office2013 to 2016 (as part of my Office365 subscription), but I couldn't get it activated. Googleing it I found several others, having the same problem, I tried lots of suggestions, with no luck. Only permanent solution was to make a clean install of Windows. Went for that, got the installation files, created a bootable thumbdrive, but couldn't get the machine started from it. Had those problems before, as I went for a preview of W10, but had to give up. Tried everything, BIOS, EFI, advanced start options in Windows, nothing worked.

So I went for the reset option in Windows, asked it to clean the drive and reinstall Windows. After this I couldn't revert to Win 8.1, so this is no option. Cleaning and install took a little over two hours, no problems found (no errors), but wasn't satisfied with the folder structure, as I installed with a Microsoft account this time, and my backup in Filehistory had the old username filestructure. Had some hassle to access the file history, but managed at last. I noticed the laggign began there, but hoped I could cure it with driver downloads from Lenovo, first with System Update, after that getting patches and drivers from the Lenovo Driver Matrix (for this machine). Installed Office, got it activated (!), so job done, I assumed. The lagging got worse, and as I said, I wasn't satisfied with the folder structure, so I went for another clean install (reset).

Installed fine again (from the Windows reset option in settings), just used Edge to download FF and Chrome Canary (have tried the regular Chrome, no difference), Kaspersky Internet Secutity 2016. Installed Thinkvantage System Update, got the recommended drivers at patches, installed them (only one that didn't install was NFC-driver). Again, opening websites, no problem at all in FF, Chrome makes the computer to work harder, but manageable. Had both FF and Chrome open, with 4 or 5 tabs each, still no major problems, Went on to youtube again, and the lagging started mediately, already on the recommendations page, with thumbnails, but no videos. Cursor has 5 seconds lag to mouse or trackpoint movement. Only way to close the tab is to use finger touch, the cursor is useless, as impossible to steer to where I want it.

I had the Task Manager open, on the Processes tab, no extensive CPU usage, FF running in one instance with about 300MB memory usage, but Chrome was running as several processes (just counted 15!), starting with 220 MB, and dropping values as I go down the list, but all put together about 700MB right now, with 3 tabs open. Is this normal? Youtube on FF alone is still lagging, but not that much as youtube on Chrome alone.

Curiously, when I brought the Task Manager to front, the lagging stopped immediately, despite the video played on in the background! Bringing the borwser to front again (still with finger touch in screen), the lagging starts again. After closing the tab with video, the lagging stops after a few seconds.

I haven't tried with some other video, as I haven't got my files restored yet. And this is another problem, I cant get access to the Filehistory files on my external drive (USB HDD), had severe problems yesterday, bur managed, now the files simply don't show up in the filehistory app. Really annoying!

I searched tons of places, haven't seen symptoms like this, there are some regarding flickering of screen (got some minor problems there, removed the GPU driver in safe mode and updated it again. To the same driver. Didn't help.

As I see it, there must be a glitch in processor management (the amount of memory, assigned to graphics or CPU functions, as the GPU is onboard without dedicated memory (Intel HD Graphics-4000). There's one unknown unit, this is Intel Smart Connect, don't use it, don't need it. Installed it the last time, didn't do any difference.

 

Next experiment: Got Intel Management And Security Status and Intel Control Centre from Lenovo Drivers and Software Download for the Helix model no. 3XXX. Installed Intel Chipset Support, Intel Management Engine Firmware and Management Engine Interface. Didn't solve anything. As expected.

Then I disabled hardware acceleration in both FF and Chrome Canary (and before, as RecumbentTim suggested in Internet settings), but without any significant change. FF runs fine without video content, Chrome lags some times, while loading a page. Just opened youtube in FF, overview page opened without problems, starting a video, the first seconds are ok, but then the cursor started lagging heavily again far beyond a point, where it is possible to place the cursor on top of a close button, it becomes a time-consuming challenge. I thank for the touch screen!

 

Any suggestions? Any help?

kovat53
Paper Tape
Posts: 5
Registered: ‎11-18-2015
Location: Hungary
Views: 1,604
Message 2 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

Hi,

I have similar problem after updating Windows 10 two days before.

Cursor lags in certain cases, even...

After booting everything is OK. Opening Start Manager cursor lags. Scrolling in any browser is horribile.

If I open let us say Task Manager, cursor moving is OK. Open another windows cursor lags again. Focusing back to the Task Manager window cursor moves OK.

Even more: at scrolling in browser windows  I got the error message sound, as in the old "IRQ times" sounded in case of IRQ collision.

I have spent hard hours to find out and I got one resolution, that is not a good one:

I boot without keyboard dock. I reset the keyboard dock with a paper clip (three LED blinks), then I put the tablet back to keyboard dock, and works fine.

 

One more: I use Cakewalk Music Creator 7 for recording my musical ideas (I am composer) and in this Window during playing or recording the cursor lags, but I think is normal because of the hard processor usege. Focusing on another window cursor moves OK (after my "resolutin").

It is horrible and unprofessional.

Somehow LENOVO or Microsoft MUST give an adequate answere

Any suggestion? Thanx. 

 

Ikes007
What's DOS?
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎11-18-2015
Location: South Africa
Views: 1,595
Message 3 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

I appear to be having the exact same problem!

I have the same Helix model and have also recently upgraded to Windows 10. I have also installed all the latest drivers and updates.

While playing video content be it in a video player or browser, touchpad and mouse input lags to an extent where the only reasonable option is to close the offending app using the touch screen. During this time. video playback is not impacted at all.

 

I've also noticed that with Task Manager open and in focus the input lag disappears but re-appears as soon as the offending app comes into focus again.

 

I've tried different browsers, different Video apps and all the same. I've also tried changing power and video performance settings to no avail.

kovat53
Paper Tape
Posts: 5
Registered: ‎11-18-2015
Location: Hungary
Views: 1,583
Message 4 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

Hi, I am back again.

 

Trying to solve my problem I found, it is enough to detach and attach again the tablet and the smooth mouse movement comes back.

Anyway, it IS a shame, and I think I payed plenty enough for my Lenovo Thinkpad Helix (that I loved very much until this time). I don't know who is responsible for this problem, but I think MS and Lenovo  should find together the suitable solution. 

Thank you!

tomtom01
Fanfold Paper
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎08-15-2015
Location: Germany
Views: 1,523
Message 5 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

Hi,

 

i had the same problem after doing a fresh windows 10 installation on my TP Helix: heavy stuttering mouse and keyboard in most applications (but not in all). The problem persisted on multiple reinstallations of windows.

 

The problem seems to be an automatic installed driver from windows update.

I fixed the problem with the following steps:

 - Reinstall Windows 10 and dont connect to the internet

 - Deactivate Windows Driver Update (http://superuser.com/questions/665158/can-i-prevent-a-driver-from-being-installed-with-windows-8-1)

 - Deactivate the windows update service

 - now connect to the internet and  install Lenovo System Update

 - install all Lenovo Updates

 - now reactivate the windows update service

Lause
Punch Card
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎01-27-2009
Location: Denmark
Views: 1,508
Message 6 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

Thanks for your replies, I have been away for a while, but back again.

 

I think I'm going to try tomtom01's solution - some time ind the future, can't be bothered right now, the Helix is up and running. Took me a week all in all, working and fiddleing most of the time, searching and reading about possible solutions... I need to pay attention to some other things, so for the time being, I'll leave the Helix as is. And here's what I did:

 

I finally startet to BIOS (couldn't via start screen, when TP logo comes up, not with pressing enter, not by touching the screen. Have to restart from Windows with advanced settings. In there I found the original Thinkpad recovery option, and used this to revert to the preinstalled, Windows 8, with all the Lenovo bloatware, I wantet to avoid in the first place.

 

Ran Windows update, got 176, installed them, upgradet to 8.1, updated again far over 100 updates, finally upgradet to Win10. Went fine, no problems during installation. Long way around, but I suspect a driver, installed with Windows 10 in the first place, question is, will it be, when installing a clean updated W10 downloaded from MS?

 

tomotm01: How old was the installationfile, you used? Fresh download?

tomtom01
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Posts: 7
Registered: ‎08-15-2015
Location: Germany
Views: 1,500
Message 7 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

downloaded it fresh (about 1 Month ago)

tc321
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Posts: 24
Registered: ‎01-12-2012
Location: Los Angeles
Views: 1,402
Message 8 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

No issue at all while back upgrading from Windows 8.1 to 10 with all software installed intact.  But after upgrading again to ver. 1511, the mouse became jittery, and lag occurred with keyboard.  This applies to the Lenovo Helix 3XXX for the on board keyboard, trackpoint, and all the various mouse and keyboards attached via a USB dock or its USB ports.

 

After another hour of upgrading the same OS, and after read up online for endless unless feedbacks and troubleshooting for days with uninstall and reinstalls, finally pop into my mind that sound card drivers could be the culprit.

On my Helix, the Realtek High Definition Audio driver dated 6/16/2015 version 6.0.1.7535 is installed along with an Intel(R) Display Audio.  In the start up, following are loaded:

 

"C:\Program Files\Realtek\Audio\HDA\RAVBg64.exe" /FORPCEE4
"C:\Program Files\Realtek\Audio\HDA\RAVBg64.exe" /LENOVO_MICPKEY
C:\Program Files\Realtek\Audio\HDA\RAVCpl64.exe -s

 

The mouse returned to normal after killing these 3 in the "Processes" of Task Manager.  So I disable these 3 Realtek "Startups" in the Task Manager then reboot, the mouse and keyboard runs smoothly with no jitters.  No need to disable the sound drivers in Device Manager.

 

Not sure which of these 3 lines cause the problem, after couple days of frustration, I don't really care.  There are no adverse affect on sound output in music or video playback with these 3 startups disabled.

 

Hope this helps.  Don't reinstall the OS and wipe your data.  Wasting days reinstalling and reconfigure your programs and data back to the original working state for 3 stuipid entries in the registry is not worth it.

 

Lause
Punch Card
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎01-27-2009
Location: Denmark
Views: 1,391
Message 9 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

I'm still running the reverted system, couldn't get bothered yet to do something about it. And at first the system ran well.

 

But a while ago, I started to notice some problems: First thing I noticed, was the BT wouldn't start or would start with faulty drivers, when starting from sleep og hibernation, so my Logitech MX Anywhere 2 wouldn't connect to the Helix. Annoying, only sortable by restarting or remove the drivers in Device Manager, let it look for new hardware and reinstall the drivers. Faster to reboot. Until:

 

Now, nearly every time, I boot the Helix, it's starting with something missing, can't exactly tell. It connects to my wifi, but there's no icon in the notification area. And on the start screen it shows up as available connections, but not connected (wifi symbol greyed out and with a cirkel). Acts strange in other ways, but I haven't had the time to check out, what's running wrong. When restarted, it takes ages, light blue display, stating: restarting and the dots running in cirkels. Usually for minutes. The other day, it got too long, so I reset the Helix at the keyboard. After restart, everything runs fine (I just have an issue connecting to my NAS, but I think this is a router issue - Netgear Nighthawk).

 

Also I'm suspecting it to slow down sometimes, I wonder if all these problems can come from too much clutter, as one OS is installed over another, which is installed over anotherone? 

 

So, when I've got the time, I'll try the "install without updates" option, as tomtom suggests, but have tc321's remark in mind. 

 

As there is a serious matter with the clean W10 installation (with updated drivers), but it runs when updated from 8/8.1 tells me there is significant difference between a clean installation and updated one. And i beleive (wiht my previous experience with Windows from (3.1) 95, over 98, Millenium, 2000, XP, Vista), a clean installation would be prefereable. 

 

To wipe my drive and restore data from Filehistory (until now I managed to do so, but has taken up to some days), is about to get routine, so i  might get faster in doing so with further experiments...

 

I just checked my startup, there's the ... /FORPCEE4 and the -s drivers, the LENOVO_MICPKEY is not listed.

Driver date is 18-12-2012, version: 6.0.1.6804

Ikes007
What's DOS?
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎11-18-2015
Location: South Africa
Views: 1,356
Message 10 of 15

Re: Helix 3XXX Windows 10 lags after clean install and Filehistory inaccessible - need help!

Awesome,

 

I've just disabled the "Realtek HD Audio Manager" (RAVCpl64) in the Startup tab of Task Manager, rebooted and I'm happy to report that the lag is gone!

 

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